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Issue when test casting a guide layout

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Kewanee

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I decided to try and build my first spinning rod. I have some guides from two broken rods and used them to save money. Rod is 7’10”. The reel is a stradic 4000 with 10# braid. I’m using Fuji kr guides and have the following guides: 25, 12, 6, 4.5kb(choke), 5x4.5kt to a 4.5 tip. I had to buy a few guides. When I purchased the guides and the building supplies, I spoke to technical support at the company. They told me this setup should work fine. The first stripper is 

22 3/4” from the reel stem, 2nd is 9 3/4”,  3rd is 8 7/8” and the choke is 7 1/4” from the 3rd reduction guide. This gives a bulls eye for a kr reduction guide layout. I used a static guide test to place the rest of the running guides at 6 7/8”, 6 1/4”, 5 1/8”, 4 3/4”, 4 1/2”, tip is 4 1/2” from the last running guide. Note that the stated distances are between guides.

At this point, I did a few test casts to see how this setup worked. The first stripper was managing the line well. No rod slap or bunching at the first stripper guide. The rod is rated 3/8 to 1 oz. This set up was casting a 3/8 oz weight quite well.
I wanted to see how the line was being managed with the rest of the guides. On the next cast the line broke. The choke guide along with all the running guides were ripped off the rod. I assume there was a lot of line build up at the choke guide and the everything failed.

Perhaps I put a little too much into the cast.

Any feedback as to what i did wrong would be much appreciated.

 

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Thanks Worcboy. Makes sense. So I already have the 25, 12, 6. Would larger running guides address this? When the line broke and the size 4.5 running guides were ripped off, I couldn’t find the running guides in the grass. Ugh, embarrassing but true. So much for saving some cash, lol.

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16 mins ago, Kewanee said:

Thanks Worcboy. Makes sense. So I already have the 25, 12, 6. Would larger running guides address this? When the line broke and the size 4.5 running guides were ripped off, I couldn’t find the running guides in the grass. Ugh, embarrassing but true. So much for saving some cash, lol.

 

First of all, what guides are you using for the reduction train, KWs, KLs, or KL-Hs?

 

Is the stradic new, and just filled with braid?  If it is, your tangles might be originating at the spool, not in the guide train.  

I prefer peace. But if trouble must come, let it come in my time, so that my children can live in peace.

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6 mins ago, EBHarvey said:

 

First of all, what guides are you using for the reduction train, KWs, KLs, or KL-Hs?

 

Is the stradic new, and just filled with braid?  If it is, your tangles might be originating at the spool, not in the guide train.  

good questions EB......

 

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EBH and Worcboy,

 

I’m using Fuji high frame guides and following the kr reduction guide layout. The three reduction guides are kl 25h, 12h, 6l.

 

the stradic 4000 isn’t new and I have not had any problems with line issues on the factory rods I have (if that helps).

 

really appreciate the input. Best

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Honestly, Id go 20H 10H  6 runners but that's just me. I've built a bunch of Batson 976's with Amtack MW25 sets. Those are different animals with 25 then 8 H and 6 runners. I end up getting extra runners. 

My favorite wachusett res lure rod I built with KLH 16. Pac bay 8ft 3 Actos swimbait blank. It chucks spoons.

 

 

 

Edited by WorcBoy
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2 hours ago, 197esmer said:

I am by no means an expert on this, but 9 guides on a 7’10” rod seems excessive. I will be watching for those in the know to answer you.

Hi 197esmer,

Sorry missed this. In my research, from what I could glean the guidance for kr/ micro guide layout suggested 1 more guide than the length of the rod. I rounded 7’10” up to 8. When I did a static load test, adding the extra running guide gave a better looking line management as well.

however, I’m definitely not an expert.

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OK, here's what I think is going on.......your reduction train is too spaced-out, so the coils coming off the spool have too much room to bounce around as they're being choked-down.  Your spacing is likely matching up with the wave frequency of those coils as well, but in a way that's making a mess of the line flow (a form of constructive interference if you want to get technical).  This is just a function of your line/reel/guides combination - it happens, and it's why test casting is so important. 

 

Tighten the whole thing up....try spacing the first two guides 8 1/2" apart, then the second and third 6 1/2" apart, then drop down to 5 1/2" between the 6 (which is functionally your choke guide) and the KB4.5.

 

If that doesn't work, and playing around with the spacing a little bit still throws tangles, I'd switch it over to a 20H>12H>7M reduction train and push the whole thing farther out from the reel - like 27" or 28", and keep that tigher spacing similar to the above.

I prefer peace. But if trouble must come, let it come in my time, so that my children can live in peace.

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