stormy monday Posted June 1 Report Share Posted June 1 So don't do that. Great line, and one that gets me thinking as I ice my elbow. I've fought tennis elbow for over 20 years, originally from tennis which I still play several times a week. I got it doing something intentionally that was not good technique and paid. Fast forward I started fishing this year in January for tidal browns with no issues, but as spring turns to summer I'm feeling some pain. Unlike past encounters though, this time it's in the early stage and I'm spending more time thinking about what I do. I recall others having this issue so I thought I'd share some things I've learned. I always thought I was hurting my elbow chucking 10 weight lines into the wind at the beach. I thought wrong. Even now with a tender elbow I find I can go out there and cast straight into the wind with no issue at all. So why the pain? I blame it on the damned brookies. Yep a 25" fish on a 10 weight no problem, but a 10" stocked brookie is raising hell with me. As I thought it through I realized the small streams where I fish don't allow a standard one hand cast. They're small streams but you're casting from the bush and usually all you can get is some abomination of a roll cast. Bow and arrow isn't quite enough. And in the bushes sometimes that roll cast is more of a sidearm thing - the line will get out, but like a bad backhand the arm position puts you in a vulnerable position. Learning that I also found that if I cast that 10 weight from an arm slot approaching sidearm the same thing happened - too much leverage on my elbow. So the rule that you can use any angle as long as you bring it straight back and forth might work for the line, but not for my arm. In real bad spots I'll sometimes roll cast across my body, very similar to a (very bad) tennis backhand and I can say for sure this triggers that pain. Just bad mechanics and actually it was this cast that causes me the most pain. So I won't do that anymore. In the end I decided to skip over that kind of location, but I also stopped roll casting to pick up line in the salt because once I hurt my elbow that became painful. I switched from a full intermediate to the floating running line Wulff BTT and replaced the roll cast with a water haul - no pain. And as a byproduct significantly less line twist than I usually get. Everyone's body is different, as mentioned I have prior injuries so improvising on body mechanics is not a good thing for me. YMMV, but if you find yourself having any elbow issues before you run to the shop to buy a new arsenal of 2H gear slow it down and look at what positions your arms are in in various situations. Might be as simple as "don't do that". Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HL Posted June 1 Report Share Posted June 1 Start with Skagit - I am. Herb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slip n slide Posted June 2 Report Share Posted June 2 11 hours ago, HL said: Start with Skagit - I am. Herb problem is that it's like throwing a brick into the pool w/ that fat line;delicacy doesn't exist I use 2 hands for all roll casts and pickups and it keeps elbow pain to a minimum TopStriperAngler and snag777 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numbskull Posted June 2 Report Share Posted June 2 I found grip size and pressure to be a contributing issue. Too narrow below the last 3 fingers encouraged too tight a grip during off vertical casts. theshadow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puppet Posted June 2 Report Share Posted June 2 50 mins ago, numbskull said: I found grip size and pressure to be a contributing issue. Too narrow below the last 3 fingers encouraged too tight a grip during off vertical casts. Can you explain further. Do you mean the cork diameter, and if so do you modify the grip/handle for better casting ergonomics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormy monday Posted June 2 Author Report Share Posted June 2 3 hours ago, numbskull said: I found grip size and pressure to be a contributing issue. Too narrow below the last 3 fingers encouraged too tight a grip during off vertical casts. I found this too to an extent. I had hand surgery years ago and have a good bit of scar tissue on my bottom 2 fingers. It influences my grip in casting as well as tennis. Using a Ritz grip is more comfortable to me and when I build grips I also make them a little oversized. I've even built some ugly foam grips on rods while searching for a good fit. I also use a tennis grip one size over standard as well for the same reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suave Posted June 2 Report Share Posted June 2 3 hours ago, stormy monday said: I found this too to an extent. I had hand surgery years ago and have a good bit of scar tissue on my bottom 2 fingers. It influences my grip in casting as well as tennis. Using a Ritz grip is more comfortable to me and when I build grips I also make them a little oversized. I've even built some ugly foam grips on rods while searching for a good fit. I also use a tennis grip one size over standard as well for the same reason. I played a lot of tennis for about 30 years and had a few "bouts" with tennis elbow albeit not acute enough to have to stop playing for awhile. I just wore an elbow brace for the time it took for the tendonitis to go away. I know wearing a brace doesn't work for every tennis player who have this problem but I wonder ifhave you tried it for fishing? If not, maybe it's worth a try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numbskull Posted June 2 Report Share Posted June 2 5 hours ago, puppet said: Can you explain further. Do you mean the cork diameter, and if so do you modify the grip/handle for better casting ergonomics? Yes, I mean the cork diameter. Although the taper and convexity of the taper under those fingers are features I also find important for other reasons. I build my own fly rods and have cut off and replaced a bunch of grips trying to get it right. At one point I felt I cast better with the narrow grip but developed elbow issues that improved after I used tennis racket tape to enlarge that area under my hand. I think the orientation of the hand during the back cast is the major cause, however. In my case leading with the back of my hand with the rod angled low while carrying a long length of line was likely the major factor. puppet 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numbskull Posted June 2 Report Share Posted June 2 I tried an elbow brace and dud not find it helpful. What did help, in addition to grip and casting motion changes, was a stretching routine when waking up in the am and before a casting session. puppet 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snapper1 Posted June 2 Report Share Posted June 2 Single handed I can't use anything bigger than an 8 weight anymore. But I use a Beulah 7/8 TH with 475 grs if necessary... My hands are basically shot... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gellfex Posted June 2 Report Share Posted June 2 2 hours ago, numbskull said: I tried an elbow brace and dud not find it helpful. All elbow braces are not created equal, most of them are too soft to really keep the tendon from popping out, even the one with a gel pressure pad won't stay in place properly. This one is hard plastic and does the job, was recommended by a cousin who is a big shot chiro. $28 on Amazon. My TE was from paddling whitewater. puppet 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Hop Posted June 3 Report Share Posted June 3 Learning to cast with my off-hand has pretty much resolved this issue for me. My right elbow gives me a fair amount of trouble from time to time and I can now just switch to casting with my left arm to give it a break. Took a lot of practice both on and off the water, but it was definitely worth the effort for a lot of reasons, including the elbow pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snag777 Posted June 3 Report Share Posted June 3 you can use any fly rod like spining rod,just mount your reel seat 12" from but or extend your but it will work much beter and easy. what you duing with fly rod is like using spining rod with one hand to cast 70 yards 1 oz lure. i come to this solution by axident. i buy spining rod to modify for fly rod,i was waiting for parts.before the parts come i use that as is for one week,first it look weerd,fly reel above second hand grip,after 4 day casting i bicome to the taist and simple easy use i like that and i never modify that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hook I Posted June 3 Report Share Posted June 3 8 hours ago, Bad Hop said: Learning to cast with my off-hand has pretty much resolved this issue for me. My right elbow gives me a fair amount of trouble from time to time and I can now just switch to casting with my left arm to give it a break. Took a lot of practice both on and off the water, but it was definitely worth the effort for a lot of reasons, including the elbow pain. Yep this is the ticket for me Learn to cast with the other hand … they now sell a fly rod you can cast with either hand Bad Hop 1 If it has fins i want to catch it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormy monday Posted June 3 Author Report Share Posted June 3 18 hours ago, gellfex said: All elbow braces are not created equal, most of them are too soft to really keep the tendon from popping out, even the one with a gel pressure pad won't stay in place properly. This one is hard plastic and does the job, was recommended by a cousin who is a big shot chiro. $28 on Amazon. My TE was from paddling whitewater. A few guys I play tennis with have these and like them. I had a neoprene one with straps above and below the elbow which did alleviate pain enough for me to continue injuring myself lol. As with off balance roll casting I've found that just identifying bad mechanics then correcting or avoiding them works best for me. That and avoiding over tightening Jorgensen wood clamps which actually gave me the worst case I ever had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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