Finneus

Anchor Wooden Beam to Concrete Foundation

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Posted (edited)

I am rebuilding the enclosed porch on the front of my house (reframe, enclose it, open up to living room, etc) and when I stripped everything away the old structure consists of a block foundation with concrete poured in the voids and a 4x8 Doug fir beam sitting on top. The beam is just resting on the foundation, no anchors. I need to fasten the beam down to the foundation and because this job is permitted I need to be able to pass an inspection.
i was looking to use wedge expansion anchors driven into the concrete, we use this at work for mounting unistrut and boxes. They are strong so I’m confident they’ll do the job but I’m not sure if they are acceptable for residential building codes. Any thoughts or other products? 
Thanks 

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Edited by Finneus

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I would think you would need a new mud sill, I would not advise reusing the beam. First they probably require a pressure treated lumber two layer sill. Two 2x6 nailed together, and bolted to the foundation. With a termite shield in between. Keep in mind it may also require hurricane strapping.

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32 mins ago, giant basshole said:

I would think you would need a new mud sill, I would not advise reusing the beam. First they probably require a pressure treated lumber two layer sill. Two 2x6 nailed together, and bolted to the foundation. With a termite shield in between. Keep in mind it may also require hurricane strapping.

For sure if I was building new, but I really didn't want to take this off and redo the sill because it's tied into the framing where it meets the house on both ends. 

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2 hours ago, Finneus said:

For sure if I was building new, but I really didn't want to take this off and redo the sill because it's tied into the framing where it meets the house on both ends. 

Understood, they do have concrete epoxy for an application like this . Drill hole through beam and into concrete to proper depth, epoxy hole and lag and let it set. Then torque to proper spec.

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Instead of asking here I would call your building officer and ask what they are going to require. You could ask 20 guys and get 20 different good answers. Only 1 counts.

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On 7/12/2022 at 8:40 PM, ted527 said:

Instead of asking here I would call your building officer and ask what they are going to require.

That's funny. Ya ask that question of any "building official" in NJ ( at least in the counties that I work in) and you will laughed at. And then told that it's not their job to tell you how to do anything. That you are supposed to know the code, etc. 

 

There's a good chance that the expansion anchors wont fly because of the risk of the CMU ( concrete block) blowing out, especially since they are probably only filled with mortar. The mortar could fail, or worse the CMU could blow out. Also most likely that they would require termite shield and then treated lumber attched to the CMU's. All stuff covered by giant basshole above. I would drill and epoxy all thread into the CMU voids, then termite shield, then 2 x 6 ACQ mudsill bolted down. Like he also suggested. Better to overdo it once, than do it twice.

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2 hours ago, Ben Lippen said:

That's funny. Ya ask that question of any "building official" in NJ ( at least in the counties that I work in) and you will laughed at. And then told that it's not their job to tell you how to do anything. That you are supposed to know the code, etc. 

 

There's a good chance that the expansion anchors wont fly because of the risk of the CMU ( concrete block) blowing out, especially since they are probably only filled with mortar. The mortar could fail, or worse the CMU could blow out. Also most likely that they would require termite shield and then treated lumber attched to the CMU's. All stuff covered by giant basshole above. I would drill and epoxy all thread into the CMU voids, then termite shield, then 2 x 6 ACQ mudsill bolted down. Like he also suggested. Better to overdo it once, than do it twice.

That was my thought too after dealing with our previous inspector but I reached out and our new guy is much more receptive.

 

I sent him some pictures and a sketch of how I’d do it with the beam in place and if it’s removed. He said based on pics the beam might be ok but he needed to put eyes on it. He is supposed to come out tomorrow and take a look and let me know which way he wants it done. 
 

if he says beam is no good then I remove it, put down termite shield, sill membrane and PT sill and build up from there. 
 

thanks for the discussion  guys 

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52 mins ago, Finneus said:

That was my thought too after dealing with our previous inspector but I reached out and our new guy is much more receptive.

 

I sent him some pictures and a sketch of how I’d do it with the beam in place and if it’s removed. He said based on pics the beam might be ok but he needed to put eyes on it. He is supposed to come out tomorrow and take a look and let me know which way he wants it done. 
 

if he says beam is no good then I remove it, put down termite shield, sill membrane and PT sill and build up from there. 
 

thanks for the discussion  guys 

I'm quite surprised that you have a guy who seems willing to work with you. And happy for you. Most of these guys, in my personal experience, are failed contractors who just want to show you their badge and be jagoffs. Back in the wild west 80's in a certain township near me a bottle of scotch and/or a C note or two would get ya passed on most anything.  No word a lie there. I've ben fixing those screwed up jobs for years.

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13 mins ago, Ben Lippen said:

I'm quite surprised that you have a guy who seems willing to work with you. And happy for you. Most of these guys, in my personal experience, are failed contractors who just want to show you their badge and be jagoffs. Back in the wild west 80's in a certain township near me a bottle of scotch and/or a C note or two would get ya passed on most anything.  No word a lie there. I've ben fixing those screwed up jobs for years.

Yes, a good surprise and a big improvement over the last guy. He wasn't corrupt, just lazy. 

I'll see what this guy says and go from there. 

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7 hours ago, Finneus said:

That was my thought too after dealing with our previous inspector but I reached out and our new guy is much more receptive.

 

I sent him some pictures and a sketch of how I’d do it with the beam in place and if it’s removed. He said based on pics the beam might be ok but he needed to put eyes on it. He is supposed to come out tomorrow and take a look and let me know which way he wants it done. 
 

if he says beam is no good then I remove it, put down termite shield, sill membrane and PT sill and build up from there. 
 

thanks for the discussion  guys 

Sometimes all you gotta do is ask, they’re not all dicks.

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13 hours ago, Ben Lippen said:

I'm quite surprised that you have a guy who seems willing to work with you. And happy for you. Most of these guys, in my personal experience, are failed contractors who just want to show you their badge and be jagoffs. Back in the wild west 80's in a certain township near me a bottle of scotch and/or a C note or two would get ya passed on most anything.  No word a lie there. I've ben fixing those screwed up jobs for years.

1977 78, Barrymore estates in Lakewood, a C note rubberbanded around a bottle, laid down in the open ditch, would get every catch basin, manhole and drainage pipe laid in that place approved. I saw it myself when I worked for a local surveying co.

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Posted (edited)

any word on the expansion anchor proposition?

Edited by chisler

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On 7/15/2022 at 9:14 PM, chisler said:

any word on the expansion anchor proposition?

Not yet, still waiting to hear back from building dept 

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On 7/15/2022 at 9:14 PM, chisler said:

any word on the expansion anchor proposition?

I ended up removing the old beams and starting fresh. I had to do some repairs to the block foundations wall and then set new sill plate with epoxy and threaded rod. I used the Simpson epoxy, worked well, really strong and sets up in a few minutes. 

Inspector was ok with either epoxy or expansion anchors but I had some unevenly filled block so the expansion anchors were a riskier proposition. 

 

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Looks good. The epoxy route is the wise choice.  I am surprised that the inspector agreed to the expansion anchor as a viable option; it lacks a degree of certainty relative to structural integrity as you mention.   

Post up more pics you go, great work.

 

 

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