Poulin

Spool get off: ever had this problem?

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I begin a new tread since this one title is more representative.

 

Almost two days in a row with new reels, the spool disengaged during a fight and fell or almost fell into the ocean. One was a Sage Spectrum LT the other was a Lamson Liquid. Sure they got a beating since fishing was good and they almost all went far on the backing, but it’s the first time I see that. I reel with my R hand. Is it the problem?

 

Any thoughts ? 

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I've never had a reel spool fall off the reel....................when it wasn't a problem I created.

 

The spool can only fall off if it isn't correctly secured by the retaining system.  And 99.99% of the time that is because you removed or at least loosened the spool and then did not correctly re-install it.  You mention reeling with your right hand.  Are we talking fly reels here?  If so, these days 100% of fly reels out of the box are set up for left hand reeling.  Did you reverse the reeling direction according to instructions from the manufacturer...then re-install the spool?  Or did you back off the drag so you could reel it with your right hand?  Or loosen the spool to avoid the drag altogether?

 

Tell me:  1) How experienced you are at fly fishing and the equipment?

                2)  Did you remove or loosen the spool for any reason?

                3)  How did you reverse the winding direction of your reels from left-hand wind to right-hand wind?

                 4)  Your reel(s) have either a lever or a button on the center shaft that must be pushed or re-positioned in order to get the spool off.  To replace he spool, on some reels you can simply press the spool on and the retaining system will click it into place,....or.....you must press the button or the lever again, push the spool into place, then release the button or lever to it's at-rest state.  Then, pull out on the spool to be sure the retainer is engaged.

 

The most likely common denominator here is YOU, not two well made reels.

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 I am having a decent backlog of experience, mainly trouts and atlantic salmons but also many stripers under the belt. Striped bass fishing is more demanding on reels than many others species because you get numbers and sizes and they fight like hell. We are talking about fly reels for sure.
 

I suspect there is something more than myself in the mix. Both reels were rigged up at good fly shops and were new. Obviously I prefer the problem being not myself but I suspect most fly reels are designed for left reeling and some are struggling digesting right reeling, especially those relying on «  screwing brake spool system ». 
 

I know folks here are gurus, I am not, maybe I am completely wrong.

 

Thanks for your attention Peter and all

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The knob that holds the spool on to the frame on the Sage most likely just came loose over time.The Lamson I looked at but doesn't show how the spool is attached.I assume it snaps where those two indentations on the drag side [I'm guessing] are located by possibly pushing in to unlock and snaps when the spool is placed back.I have a Cheeky Limitless reel that was given to me in lew of payment for work done.It has the knob similar to the Sage and I had that come loose on me.I didn't need the reel but had to take it or lose out totally.Configuring the reels left or right shouldn't make a difference.

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Don't know about the Sage , but the Liquid I have. The spool snaps on,  the retainer is internal. To swap direction of the reel, you remove  the gear  from the center hub (should only be snugged finger tight) and reverse the one way roller bearing. Sometimes the bearing doesn't seat quite right when you put it back in and it holds the spool out a bit. I'd try that first. I've never had it happen on the water, and I have a lot of Lamsons with many good fish on all of them.

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Did it years ago with a battenkill disc. 
 

I didn’t properly push in the lever on the spool when I slid it on the shaft and then release it when it was seated. Popped off during a fight with a small steelhead. 
 

Always double and triple checked them after that. Never happened again. 

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Rt hand reeling for 63 years.  That was the only direction way back then.  For decades now have had to convert all new reels from left to right.

 

Shadow is correct, the direction should not and likely does not matter.  I was not implying that it did.  But I was implying that someone converting it incorrectly....... or correctly but re-installing the spool incorrectly could be the problem.  Or.....not converting it but trying to overcome the directional drag system might lead one to do something that would leave the spool loose.

 

Did you or someone from the fly shop convert that reel from lt hand to rt hand reeling?  The fastest way to get an answer is to take those reels back to the fly shop or someone very experienced with reels and let them check them out.  Likely the answer will come within 30 seconds.

 

No, it should not happen.....ever....no matter how far into the backing or how many fish.  I could be wrong but I'm still betting on operator error, either at the fly shop or in your hands.  Nothing to be ashamed of.  I never said I have never had a spool come loose, only that it was always my fault.  New equipment always has quirks and tricks that one has to learn by experience.

 

One of the problems associated with converting from lt to rt is that during reeling one is turning the knob on the spool in the opposite direction than it was designed.  The correct design will have the reeling in direction to TIGHTEN the screw system holding the knob on.  Reverse the reel and one is UNscrewing the knob screw when reeling.  The knob should turn freely, and there should be a cinch system as backup, but get crud into the knob or bend it and turning the knob while reeling in under pressure puts loosening torque on the screw.

 

Having the spool knob fall off during a fight is about as much fun as you experienced. And that little knob....or screw is much more likely to disappear forever than your spool is.  Since I must convert all my reels I have had it happen multiple times....with multiple reels.  Locktite is your friend.

Edited by Peter Patricelli

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The direction absolutely matters on some reels. I had this issue on three Ross products (2 ross, 1 abel sdf). I'm too slammed to dig them out for picts but the spool attaches to the frame at a small part that is threaded the same way (to loosen) when R hand wind. If that part is loose, or maybe just from general use it loosen it will work itself off the frame and take the entire spool with it.

 

It happened to me three times. Two were ross reels, same model different size. One was the Abel. The first time that it happened I thought it was a fluke and never checked the other reel. The other reel went, fine. I never checked the Abel, I never saw the need to but it went as well. When I put that one back together I saw it was the exact same design as Ross.

 

All three reels came to me R hand wind as I requested. My understanding is that they leave the factory left handed. Perhaps something wasn't tightened, don't know. I also accept some responsibility here but ultimately it's a piss poor design and I will NEVER buy another Ross product again.

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Drew C's post is interesting.  Exact same general mechanism as my knob/handle problem.  Reels designed for lt hand reeling and poor backup for conversion to rt hand reeling.  But then, I have never owned an Abel, Ross, or Sage.  My old Lamson's are too simplistic to have that internal unscrewing problem.  And every time a spool has loosened for me it was incomplete seating when re-installing....as Maine Guide recounts.

 

Drew's experience suggests that that possibly the same person did the conversions on all three reels (?) and leaves open the possibility of incomplete tightening or not using a Locktite-like product that might have been factory recommended.  If the OP's reels were all converted at the fly shop at the same time by the same person.  Could be a similar error.  But he did not say that the spool came off with internal guts still attached to it.  ??

 

Now I see the other thread and the additional information there and here.  There is no doubt that all screws and threaded parts are unidirectional.....one direction tightening, the other loosening.....and doing a conversion raises questions about the original design and possibilities of failure.  From the original thread sounds as though the first failure was similar to Drew's, the retaining cap unscrewed during a run.  A screw-on retaining cap.  Who woulda thunk?  The detente-in-a-groove system is so simple.....and NON-directional.

 

This implies to me that there are a LOT of people doing conversions that do NOT understand the potential weakness of the design on certain reels.  Also implies Locktite would solve the problem, but what a pain every time you want to remove or change the spool.

 

A lesson here for everyone t o take note of.

Edited by Peter Patricelli

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For the records, the switch to R hand had been done by a top guy at a top fly shop. It could have been human fault when switching it but let’s say the risk is very low to nil.

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Posted (edited) · Report post

If one was left hand wind, the issue that i experienced would not have happened. 

 

The Abel went when I was stripping (hard) the line off the reel at the beginning of a trip, in order to get some line out and make a cast. There was a plop, the spool went in to the Farmy and there were quite a few 4 letter words on my part. I was in a place that if things had happened a little differently, I might have lost the spool. 

 

I've been really busy with work this week but I can try and get some pics up, maybe over the weekend. The best that I can describe it - the frame piece has it's drag assembly. At that end is a small threaded piece, a cap. Remove that, and you get inside the drag mechanism and that's there one would change the retrieve as well. That small threaded part/cap, that's where the spool attaches. Right hand wind spins the spool in the same direction as the piece that is one the end of the drag assembly. If something is loose that piece works itself off and takes the spool with it. If one is using the reel left hand wind, that can't ever happen.

 

I don't know if Poulin's reels have the same problem.

 

I'm guessing that in my situation, the reels left the factory left hand wind. I ordered R hand wind reels and I am guessing that the seller switched them and didn't snug them properly. I don't have any other theory. Since that problem I have made sure that the reels are snug, and I mean snug. All three have been ok since that time. All three came from different retailers. Again, I can't think of any other reason. All three reels went over a relatively short period of time in early 2021. I got them at some point in 2020, used them a good bit until the depths of the winter in 20/21. I took them out in the spring and had the issue with all three in a short period of time. I'll definitely take some blame here but not all of it.

 

Again, imho - crappy design.

Edited by Drew C.

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Sounds like we had the same problem Drew. Switching from left to right hand probably changes nothing on some reels but it seems to be a problem on particular ones.

 

On my Sage, the knob that went off is outside and can be checked regularly, that’s what I will do.

 

On the Lamson, the device is internal. When you feel the problem, it’s too late. I had the reel re-switched to left. No chance to be taken, will learn to reel fron L hand.

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Sounds like the spool on the lamson was not fully engaged.  Had this happen first time i changed a spool on a new lamson.  When putting the spool on you should press it equally with your fingers from two opposite sides of the spool and pull into the frame.  It should click into place.  I like to hold the reel frame with my palms and use my fingers to press it into the frame.  Hope this makes sense.  

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8 hours ago, MikeK said:

Sounds like the spool on the lamson was not fully engaged.  Had this happen first time i changed a spool on a new lamson.  When putting the spool on you should press it equally with your fingers from two opposite sides of the spool and pull into the frame.  It should click into place.  I like to hold the reel frame with my palms and use my fingers to press it into the frame.  Hope this makes sense.  

Don’t think so. The cap that is screwed on the break system to « seal » it was completely unscrewed and was on the pool shaft.

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