bob_G

Man, I'm not liking all these seals

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Let's not forget about the an entire labor force that's been eliminated. 

For decades, college students from  all over New England would flock to the Cape for summer jobs. 5-6 students would get together, rent a home for the summer, line up summer jobs, and spend the summer on the Cape. Hanging out with girls, the beach, cruising the Main streets of Hyannis, Yarmouth, and P town till 2am.   Rents were cheap, so was gas. Life was good.

That ship sailed.  College kids had their summer jobs lined up by March.   Do college students even work anymore?

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2 hours ago, ANGCorsair said:

There is no longer any swimming on the ocean side due to the sharks. The bay side beaches are harder to gain access to now as the towns have locked them up for the residents. So now you have a tourist industry which has lost fishermen, ocean swimming and most of the bay swimming. Seal watchers are far and few between. People will go once but few return daily or even annually to see them. Now it’s just becoming a prestige vacation and that will end soon when there’s nothing to do there. 

It won’t end soon. Rental prices are higher than ever. I used to rent a cape house for a week for many years. We have stopped and go to nicer places for cheaper. It’s cheaper to go to the Keys or Sanibel than Cape Cod. It’s craziness. 

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Posted (edited)

22 mins ago, z-man said:

It won’t end soon. Rental prices are higher than ever. I used to rent a cape house for a week for many years. We have stopped and go to nicer places for cheaper. It’s cheaper to go to the Keys or Sanibel than Cape Cod. It’s craziness. 

Z,

 

I used to say the same thing. If you did your homework,  it was cheaper to go to the Bahamas or Caribbean than it was to Cape Cod.

Not to mention,  beginning in late August on Cape Cod, there's always the chance of running into a hurricane.   But weather aside, you have to deal with endless traffic issues.

Edited by bob_G

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18 mins ago, z-man said:

It won’t end soon. Rental prices are higher than ever. I used to rent a cape house for a week for many years. We have stopped and go to nicer places for cheaper. It’s cheaper to go to the Keys or Sanibel than Cape Cod. It’s craziness. 

You're absolutely right.

 

And as much as I like shore fishing in New England, there are some incredible opportunities in Florida for the wily surfcasting bum. Maybe not in their first (week/month)"year" down there, but a little experience leads to big gains (aka fish) in Florida 

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6 mins ago, rst3 said:

You're absolutely right.

 

And as much as I like shore fishing in New England, there are some incredible opportunities in Florida for the wily surfcasting bum. Maybe not in their first (week/month)"year" down there, but a little experience leads to big gains (aka fish) in Florida 

We have a condo right on the beach booked on Sanibel this summer. I’m looking forward to waking up and just walking out the door to fish the beach. The places I would rent on the cape I would still have to drive or bike to the beach. Beach front rentals are way too expensive. 

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8 hours ago, z-man said:

We have a condo right on the beach booked on Sanibel this summer. I’m looking forward to waking up and just walking out the door to fish the beach. The places I would rent on the cape I would still have to drive or bike to the beach. Beach front rentals are way too expensive. 

Sanibel is beautiful, 

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1 min ago, gray gables said:

Sanibel is beautiful, 

Starting to come around on this as well. I used to shun FL but the economics and other factors are really making it an attractive part time option if youre a fishing addict. I can even overlook the fact that the state is a cultural vacuum if i can satisfy the fishing jones. Some great natural areas for other outdoor activities as well. And they seem to take fishing regulation enforcement more seriously there. 

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16 hours ago, CoffeeHangover said:

The seals were here before us and with any luck they'll be here after us.  They've been a constant variable in the equation of ecosystem health, except when they've been reduced by our actions.  Maybe we should look at the variables that have changed which impact the fisheries health such as commercial and recreational harvests. 

 

Yes, seals have been around for a long time.... but what was the population of seals back then? 

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5 mins ago, JRT said:

 

Yes, seals have been around for a long time.... but what was the population of seals back then? 

Are you implying there are more seals now than historically?

That doesn't even make sense.

How many hundreds of miles of beaches that seals would have used for breeding are now highly developed by humans?

 

Also if you're going to compare now to the past, you'd have to also ask, what were the fish populations like back then?

Before commercial and recreational fishing, pollution and dams, there would have been enough fish to support a much larger seal population. 

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7 mins ago, mikez2 said:

Are you implying there are more seals now than historically?

That doesn't even make sense.

How many hundreds of miles of beaches that seals would have used for breeding are now highly developed by humans?

 

Also if you're going to compare now to the past, you'd have to also ask, what were the fish populations like back then?

Before commercial and recreational fishing, pollution and dams, there would have been enough fish to support a much larger seal population. 

 

And how do you know that there were more seals back then? As I say, without data its assumption.

Rats have been around before humans but I guess you would want them controlled even though they have been around since back in the day?

With less fish about - due to whatever reasons (human consumption, pollution, global warming etc) the impact of unchecked seals is greater. 

The argument that humans shouldn't manage the environment is crass and ignores reality.

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17 mins ago, JRT said:

 

And how do you know that there were more seals back then? As I say, without data its assumption.

Rats have been around before humans but I guess you would want them controlled even though they have been around since back in the day?

With less fish about - due to whatever reasons (human consumption, pollution, global warming etc) the impact of unchecked seals is greater. 

The argument that humans shouldn't manage the environment is crass and ignores reality.

I don't know, obviously, but common sense suggests with vastly more land available to breed and more fish to eat, there would be more seals.

Common sense also suggests that there's no way there's more seals now than ever before. That one's a no-brainer. With a fraction of the available land to breed on and a fraction of the available fish stock to eat, it defies logic to suggest such a thing.

 

I never made any argument that humans shouldn't manage the environment. That's a completely different conversation which has nothing to do with my comments about the historical population of seals.

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36 mins ago, mikez2 said:

I don't know, obviously, but common sense suggests with vastly more land available to breed and more fish to eat, there would be more seals.

Common sense also suggests that there's no way there's more seals now than ever before. That one's a no-brainer. With a fraction of the available land to breed on and a fraction of the available fish stock to eat, it defies logic to suggest such a thing.

 

I never made any argument that humans shouldn't manage the environment. That's a completely different conversation which has nothing to do with my comments about the historical population of seals.

There may have been more predators like sharks and orcas back then to keep the seal population in check. Who knows? 

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1 hour ago, JRT said:

 

Yes, seals have been around for a long time.... but what was the population of seals back then? 

I'm no biologist but it stands to reason in my mind that with more food and habitat the population would expand until it reached an equilibrium wherein the food sources couldn't support a larger population or predators cull enough to control the numbers.  In the 4,000 odd years that seals have been present it doesn't seem that striped bass, cod or flounder went extinct but in the time that humans have been here there's been a noticeable decline in all 3 species populations.  We as humans are putting too great a load onto the ecosystem and it puts us at odds with other species which rely on those fish.  

 

 

"Seals have inhabited Cape Cod for some 4,000 years, but for the past century or so, they’ve been scarce in this part of the world. New England fishermen in the 19th century saw the animals as competition for their cod harvest and killed as many as 135,000 of them between 1888 and 1962."
https://www.nrdc.org/onearth/cape-cods-gray-seal-and-white-shark-problem-anything-black-and-white#:~:text=Seals have inhabited Cape Cod,them between 1888 and 1962.

The_Return_of_the_Seals_167464.pdf

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5 mins ago, CoffeeHangover said:

 

"Seals have inhabited Cape Cod for some 4,000 years, but for the past century or so, they’ve been scarce in this part of the world. New England fishermen in the 19th century saw the animals as competition for their cod harvest and killed as many as 135,000 of them between 1888 and 1962."
https://www.nrdc.org/onearth/cape-cods-gray-seal-and-white-shark-problem-anything-black-and-white#:~:text=Seals have inhabited Cape Cod,them between 1888 and 1962.

The_Return_of_the_Seals_167464.pdf

Those were the days. :p

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It cracks me up when some people blame 'humans' for things, as if we aren't part of the animal world, of indigenous to the planet.  lol

And those same people say how much they 'care' about others.

 

I haven't been much past the Canal in so many years I can't remember....& I have relatives there.

Most of the new people on the Cape are -very well off-, & don't care about much of anything but walking to nowhere for no reason.

 

Last I heard, the 'ocean side' lifeguards on Cape Cod don't let their kids enter the water!

 

 

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