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Casting Penn Conventionals Without Brakes

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KarpsnKatz

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8 hours ago, Surf bomber said:

Magnetic vs centrifugal brakes, Level wind vs non level wind , the main line diameter (over 20 lb test)… a full spool vs a 3/4 or less  spool .. metal spool vs aluminum spool , all will affect a professional backlash, lol lol lol  …. And still requires an edjumacated thumb .. 

What do you prefer, magnetic or centrifugal brakes? What would be your ideal set up for throwing an old Penn spooled with 20lb mono?

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2 hours ago, Mike Mendez said:

I like casting old Penns and especially Newells without brakes.  It's kind of like driving a manual versus automatic shift.  Automatics are easier to drive, but the extra skill needed to drive a stick is fun.

 

I will say that casting at night is a lot more difficult that casting in sunlight.  Even with an educated thumb, it is very difficult to know when the bait hits the water.

 

I use a Curado 100D with 8# mono in the surf.  I removed the plastic brakes and added ABEC-7 bearings.  It is super fun to cast with a long rod and I can outcast just about everyone at my local beach.  Sometimes, especially in summer, long casts will catch yellowfin croaker 2:1 compared to short and medium casts.

I find that the key to casting at night is having a consistent cast. That make it easier to determine when the bait is going to hit the water.

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Casting an old penn …mono mag you can adjust easily.. centrifugal brakes your locked in unless you pull the side plate .. static magnets your locked in and can’t adjust … next question will the mono mag have enough of travel in and out ? Are The plates are close to the spool  …. I have a penn 535 and a mono will fit but I never looked at my other senators …beech bob in distance casting , static magged an old penn and illustrated how he did it … pimp my reel on u tube may have a video that will shed more info on it … if the mono mag will fit, surf cast pro shop in Maryland maybe the only folks who have them and other very nice toys for the surf caster … when the wind shifts to on shore you will want a mono mag …. Always use the appropriate shock leader … 

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2 hours ago, Midnightpass said:

Mike... Weren't you using that Curado when I fished with you?...

Butch

Yep... same setup as in my Avatar.  I actually have 2 and rotate them between services.  I recently bought 2 Tranx 200XGs to replace them, but I've been using them so long there's a strong emotional attachment.  I may do the swap when the fish start biting in earnest in May/June.

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5 hours ago, Surf bomber said:

Casting an old penn …mono mag you can adjust easily.. centrifugal brakes your locked in unless you pull the side plate .. static magnets your locked in and can’t adjust … next question will the mono mag have enough of travel in and out ? Are The plates are close to the spool  …. I have a penn 535 and a mono will fit but I never looked at my other senators …beech bob in distance casting , static magged an old penn and illustrated how he did it … pimp my reel on u tube may have a video that will shed more info on it … if the mono mag will fit, surf cast pro shop in Maryland maybe the only folks who have them and other very nice toys for the surf caster … when the wind shifts to on shore you will want a mono mag …. Always use the appropriate shock leader … 

Thanks, I'll check that info out.

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10 hours ago, animalbarrie said:

Yeah they don’t make it anymore.   Took me a long time of searching to find a black Torque 12 and 15.   They never made a black 25, wish they did though.  
 

You can find them in gold pretty easy but they are crazy expensive now and then you need to add a mag if you want to surf cast it.   Not worth the money, you could get three fathom 2’s for the same price.  I’ll post a few pics.  They are little tanks.  

 

 I have a black torque 12 also and it is a sweet little machine. It is my best casting conventional. 

"what good are tractors without violins" ?   jose figueres

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 All but one of my saltwater casters / conventionals have mag brakes. I still have the reel I learned on which was my fathers Penn 200 Surfmaster but that's pretty much retired. I'm only using sealed spinners for wading. When ever possible I'm throwing a caster. 

 

IMG_0399.jpg

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Edited by nfnDrum
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Penn 146 in full metal jacket with knobby mag control. Hands off till touchdown using braid (50lb) and a 50lb mono shocker. I have a 140 rigged the same way. I am of the opinion that eliminating the negative variables is the goal- knobby mag control does exactly that.

Not looking to get into an argument but the mindset of the virtue of the educated thumb is just the tyranny of tradition. Its' like saying you aren't a real driver unless you drive non power steering or non  power drum brakes. 

Marc

IMG_0091.jpg

Edited by mml4

"Don't mess with old farts...age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill! BS and brilliance only come with age and experience!"

In favor of an immediate moratorium on both Commercial and Recreational taking of Striped Bass.

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ive fished using Penn Squidder, Long Beach and Jigmaster from the surf for 45yrs.  You don't need a magnetic brake.  They sure seem nice but to me it's just another point of potential failure that, to me, reduces the simplicity of the reel design. 

 

Penn conventional reels still have an adjustment on the side opposite the handle to control the free spooling.  You can use that to control most issues like backlash, run-on, etc...you can even eliminate or just reduce the need to control the cast with your thumb.  It just takes a lot of practice.  

 

I should add I have never used modern braid on any of them, they were stolen with most of my garage years ago.  However last year I splurged with the fancy shiny US Senator Limited 113N to replace the old reels simply for surf fishing.  These are not everyone's cup-of-tea but consider that those reel designs have been fished for over a century.  Sure there can be some royal pain-in-the-behind snarls but those serve to make you take more time and pay better attention.

 

Most of my time using them was pait fishing or when adding a couple curly-tail Gulp grubs on a high-low rig then just casting it out into a tough area and letting the surf create the movement...this works great actually and sure saved me a lot of digging for sand crabs...

 

I totally like the modern mag brake reels too.  For me though I developed the ability to use standard conventional reels pretty easily.  Plus they are dead simply to service as needed.  Now if someone gave me a modern mag-style conventional I sure would spend a lot of time learning to use it as, to me, they look super versatile.  Casting artificals has to be less worrisome in the wind especially (then again I can simply adjust the free spooling on my Penn).  Now that I'm older I might appreciate the few ounces difference in weight casting.  FOr simply bait fishing I do not see any benefit as I'm used to casting them for hours over the course of a day on the surf.  I guess no matter which you prefer you simply need to spnd the time learning to weaknesses and the strengths?

Edited by rkw
grammer
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Im still waiting for someone to chime in saying they can successfully cast a more "modern" penn reel without any brakes at all.

 

Intead of bushing spool reels running with thinned grease. With a huge spool lip for thumbing.

 

Im thinking reels with hot sauce oil, TF Rocket oil, TSI 321, in spool bearings, ungrease pinion shafts in a Gen¹²³⁴ 515, 525, squall, squall2, fathom.

 

A really good reel can freespin past 2 minutes with no brakes.

3-20 seconds with mags or blocks.

Hits stupid rpm numbers on a power cast.

Sinker speeds can travel over 100mph, achieve a 300yard flight in about 9 seconds airtime.

 

A thumb can only get one, a certain distance. Lol

 

Edited by EricL

i use 2/3 rule for trading. join date, posts, or vouch. whoever has less goes first.

(*member formerly known as 'ooeric')

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8 hours ago, rkw said:

ive fished using Penn Squidder, Long Beach and Jigmaster from the surf for 45yrs.  You don't need a magnetic brake.  They sure seem nice but to me it's just another point of potential failure that, to me, reduces the simplicity of the reel design. 

 

Penn conventional reels still have an adjustment on the side opposite the handle to control the free spooling.  You can use that to control most issues like backlash, run-on, etc...you can even eliminate or just reduce the need to control the cast with your thumb.  It just takes a lot of practice.  

 

I should add I have never used modern braid on any of them, they were stolen with most of my garage years ago.  However last year I splurged with the fancy shiny US Senator Limited 113N to replace the old reels simply for surf fishing.  These are not everyone's cup-of-tea but consider that those reel designs have been fished for over a century.  Sure there can be some royal pain-in-the-behind snarls but those serve to make you take more time and pay better attention.

 

Most of my time using them was pait fishing or when adding a couple curly-tail Gulp grubs on a high-low rig then just casting it out into a tough area and letting the surf create the movement...this works great actually and sure saved me a lot of digging for sand crabs...

 

I totally like the modern mag brake reels too.  For me though I developed the ability to use standard conventional reels pretty easily.  Plus they are dead simply to service as needed.  Now if someone gave me a modern mag-style conventional I sure would spend a lot of time learning to use it as, to me, they look super versatile.  Casting artificals has to be less worrisome in the wind especially (then again I can simply adjust the free spooling on my Penn).  Now that I'm older I might appreciate the few ounces difference in weight casting.  FOr simply bait fishing I do not see any benefit as I'm used to casting them for hours over the course of a day on the surf.  I guess no matter which you prefer you simply need to spnd the time learning to weaknesses and the strengths?

Your points are well taken but I don't like to increase the friction on the spool by side loading it with the adjuster. Mag control is dynamic and self adjusts depending on the rpm of the spool resulting in longer casts. 

 

 I have also reached my "senior" years and have fished conventional ,mostly Penns and Newells, from the surf with no problem when using mono. Braid is another story. 15-20 casts no problem and then blow up. Plus I have to concentrate too much when using braid on a conventional. For me it is not relaxing. Add the knobby or static mags, tune it once and go about your business. 

Marc

"Don't mess with old farts...age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill! BS and brilliance only come with age and experience!"

In favor of an immediate moratorium on both Commercial and Recreational taking of Striped Bass.

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Due to shoulder problems, I don’t plug anymore, but when I did, t was always with thumb levelers. I tried a whole lot of them over the years but stopped looking when I found the Penn Fathom 12(first issue) the reel has brake blocks like an Abu. I engage one block and leave a wee bit of side to side for the spool. 3in1 Blue(5wt?) in the bearings and it casts effortlessly all night long. Now that I only chunk, I’ve gone back to my Squidders, especially the one with the Newell spool and bars. When throwing 3 or more ounces, I get the same distance with the 140 as I do with the Fathom. There’s something special about fishing with a reel that was introduced in 1938 and dominated the surfcasting scene until the 1980s. Mine ride on honey Lamis too

.........Elvis lives....2020

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19 hours ago, mml4 said:

Penn 146 in full metal jacket with knobby mag control. Hands off till touchdown using braid (50lb) and a 50lb mono shocker. I have a 140 rigged the same way. I am of the opinion that eliminating the negative variables is the goal- knobby mag control does exactly that.

Not looking to get into an argument but the mindset of the virtue of the educated thumb is just the tyranny of tradition. Its' like saying you aren't a real driver unless you drive non power steering or non  power drum brakes. 

Marc

IMG_0091.jpg

I think there is no right or wrong, it just boils down to preference and comfort level. A lot of posts are certainly making a good case for mags and brakes.

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