Caveman8

Why not a long mono leader on a spinning reel?

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It seems to me that a long mono leader tied to braid with a thin knot on a spinning reel would make a lot of sense. 

It would remove a swivel that might be pulled through the guides by accident, and keep sharp braid away from the casting finger.

However I don't see this on spinning reels, just conventional reels.

I'm guessing it doesn't work so well on spinners?

Does an FG knot hang up or produce excessive drag on a cast through the guides?

Haven't had a chance to test it myself but I have to assume many have.

Have you tried this? What is the result?

Thanks for any info.

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I usually do something similar - a 2 to 3 foot leader tied on with a swivel that I am careful to keep out of the tip top.

I'm wondering why not use a 10 foot leader tied on with an FG knot and reel the knot on to the spool for casting.

It seems reasonable with a thin braid to mono knot, but I don't see this setup in practice, and don't read about it as a viable option.

I'm guessing there are some negatives, wondering if someone has tried it and what their experience was.

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I use about 12 feet of mono as a leader on my 9 footers, tie an fg knot and I clip the mono tag and melt it, if you get decent at tying them they will slide right through no problem, never reel it onto the spool though. 

Edited by Snook_Slayr

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I have been playing around with the FG knot to mono leader thing this year. I have to say I really like it on 7.5 ft rod. I think with a 20lb Big Game mono to 20lb PP I was able to wind the leader onto the reel and it would cast pretty good. I tried it with 30lb Big Game mono and it didn't work. The cast really slowed down as the leader went through the stripping guide. 

 

I like having a long leader to grab when landing a fish as well not worrying about the swivel and the rod tip. Downside is lack of attachment for teasers.

 

On a longer rod I think I'll just stick with the swivel. I never reel up that close anyways and I tend to be holding rod up higher. These shorter rods be holding them down by water so you know how that goes.  

 

 

Edited by TopStriperAngler

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I use about 6 feet of leader and just keep it outside the guides. I don't find any more than that to be necessary and I don't like hearing a knot fly through my guides.  I had a PR knot unravel going through the guides once and that was enough for me to stop doing it.

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I use long leaders. They start between the stripper guide and the first runner...My experience with leaders starting between reel and stripper guide wasn't good :niffty:Probably because of line slap...

Same rule for striper rigs or popping rigs with heavier leaders. I use FG knot Rizz finish.

 

Cheers

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It's entirely appropriate to fish a tied long leader and as mentioned an FG knot is effective for the task.  The potential issue has less to do with the knott's profile and almost everything to do with the difference in stiffness between monofilament leader and a supple braided running line.  

 

On a conventional rod it's not an issue because the spool spins as line rolls off which prevents the line from catching the knot in the spool and there are no coils as  line flows off the reel.  As the line peels off the spool on a conventional reel it is flowing in a straight path, not rotating off the spool as on a spinning reel.  

 

As line rotates off a spinning reel, the difference in stiffness between the knot/ monofilament and the soft braid can worsen the choking that occurs when the coils run through the guides and could cause the softer braid to wrap around the guides as their rotating toward the stripper guide, especially with higher line speeds and heavier mono leaders because the heavier stiffer front of the line slows down before the braid has a chance to respond and so the soft coils continue forward and either pass through the guide or wrap around it.

 

If your surf fishing..... almost any line to leader knot will do, I avoid that stuff with a surf rod and just fish anywhere from 2 to 5' leaders off a barrel.  

Edited by DeepBlue85

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^^^ what he said ^^^ . . . the concern is not as much as the knot catching or scraping the guides during the cast as it is catching or snagging as it peels off the spool . . .

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very Long mono leader is a non issue on a bottom fishing type coventional reel, but in the surf on a spinning reel,  there are draw backs...

 

* I use 5-6  foot leader to a small 130lb size 4 spro swivel in the surf. I use the longest 50# mono leader possible, so my swivel stops just before the tip .  it doesnt slam into the tip guide once you get a feel for the length you use (and even if you do sometimes, the 130lb spro is small enough to not knock out a guide) 

 

   *having a longer 50# leader going through your guides and wrapping on the reeal a bit will decrease casting distance, and your knot (that is in place of the swivel) will weaken as it goes through your guides.  

 

   * I also like a swivel to eliminate line twist, which will lead to twisted knots in your braid. 

 

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11 hours ago, Caveman8 said:

It seems to me that a long mono leader tied to braid with a thin knot on a spinning reel would make a lot of sense. 

It would remove a swivel that might be pulled through the guides by accident, and keep sharp braid away from the casting finger.

However I don't see this on spinning reels, just conventional reels.

I'm guessing it doesn't work so well on spinners?

Does an FG knot hang up or produce excessive drag on a cast through the guides?

Haven't had a chance to test it myself but I have to assume many have.

Have you tried this? What is the result?

Thanks for any info.

because you'd be retying that leader after the blow by knot 

That or you'll be retying after it catches on the spool

Edited by scoobydoo

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3 hours ago, DeepBlue85 said:

It's entirely appropriate to fish a tied long leader and as mentioned an FG knot is effective for the task.  The potential issue has less to do with the knott's profile and almost everything to do with the difference in stiffness between monofilament leader and a supple braided running line.  

 

On a conventional rod it's not an issue because the spool spins as line rolls off which prevents the line from catching the knot in the spool and there are no coils as  line flows off the reel.  As the line peels off the spool on a conventional reel it is flowing in a straight path, not rotating off the spool as on a spinning reel.  

 

As line rotates off a spinning reel, the difference in stiffness between the knot/ monofilament and the soft braid can worsen the choking that occurs when the coils run through the guides and could cause the softer braid to wrap around the guides as their rotating toward the stripper guide, especially with higher line speeds and heavier mono leaders because the heavier stiffer front of the line slows down before the braid has a chance to respond and so the soft coils continue forward and either pass through the guide or wrap around it.

 

If your surf fishing..... almost any line to leader knot will do, I avoid that stuff with a surf rod and just fish anywhere from 2 to 5' leaders off a barrel.  

I've run into the same problem fishing with a long leader and mono running line.  I like the long leader when I'm boat fishing up in Long Island Sound, where there are a lot of big, barnacle-encrusted rocks for a fish to cut off on.  But tying a heavier, stiffer fluoro leader for maximum abrasion resistance to lighter, more supple mono can lead to the running line wrapping on a guide at the biginning of a cast.

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There are a lot of threads on this subject dating back years, some of them contentious. I went into a bit of a hole last week reading them -- the result of a cracked tip top guide that was slicing my braid, which took me too long to locate ;) Anyway, I now know more on the subject than I ever wanted to.

 

At the end of the day, you'll have to find what works for your style of fishing and environment you encounter. If a long leader sounds like a good idea to you, it probably is. Long story short, yes, a long mono leader on a spinner is doable, with potential caveats. If it is mono-mono rather than mono-braid it gets quite hard to pass a know through the guides on a spinner, but a blob knot or nail knot can work. Anything over 50lb mono leader, in my experience and from my reading anyway, the knot gets too big to pass through easily also.

 

FG knot, nail knot, alberto/albright, uni to uni, etc are generally strong enough, but provide varying levels of ease in tying in the field and knot width. A pre-tied leader with swivel may be the ticket for those retying frequently in adverse conditions.

 

Before this thread devolves into what a shock leader is and is not, so long as your braid is strong enough to cast your lure, the mono leader is just for fish handling and abrasion resistance, and meant to be replaced to save wear on the main line. Again, many subtleties and caveats come into specific scenarios, which I won't write 3000 words on at this moment :)

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