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New to bailess

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In the market for a bailess reel to start learning on but, at a crossroads. Considering a spinfisher IV or the Penn Z series type ...price is a factor.... not looking for a VS or Zeebaas . I am aware of the differences between the two reels mentioned above but, for those who do throw bailess what did you learn on and would use today?

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I learned on a Spinfisher V. Now I’m using Van Staal’s without looking back. They are most definitely worth the money if you use them as intended. If not, a Spinfisher is just fine. Just pack the gearbox with grease so the rotor doesn’t spin when you cast.

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If you don't want to spend VS or ZB money but you still want a tough, bailless reel that you can fish in heavy surf and even submerge then a 704z with a conversion kit is a good place to start. As Asrod said, pack the gearbox with grease and clean/relube it after dunking it.

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20201204_120227.jpg.9e04a67830c957a2cba19a6b8aa2a0fb.jpg

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Posted (edited) · Report post

7 hours ago, ASrod said:

I learned on a Spinfisher V. Now I’m using Van Staal’s without looking back. They are most definitely worth the money if you use them as intended. If not, a Spinfisher is just fine. Just pack the gearbox with grease so the rotor doesn’t spin when you cast.

The rotor only spins if the reel is timed poorly or untimed. The grease is the right solution for a different problem but doesn't fix the handle from spinning during a cast it only masks the problem in my opinion. The handle shouldn't spin with or without grease.

Edited by SC

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6 hours ago, Sandbar1 said:

If you don't want to spend VS or ZB money but you still want a tough, bailless reel that you can fish in heavy surf and even submerge then a 704z with a conversion kit is a good place to start. As Asrod said, pack the gearbox with grease and clean/relube it after dunking it.

20201204_120211.jpg.532cd1976b6df4d7a21e1c0711ec5121.jpg

 

20201204_120243.jpg.f0015bbaa99407e8e68cad40fe315ba9.jpg

 

 

20201204_120227.jpg.9e04a67830c957a2cba19a6b8aa2a0fb.jpg

Why do so many people think you can't "dunk" a 704? I fished them submerged for decades and only cleaned /  re-lubed / re-built every winter. Never had a problem and either did anyone else that I am aware of. The "dunking" issue is totally misunderstood or the newer reels are totally different. Never had a 704 fail ever.

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2 hours ago, SC said:

Why do so many people think you can't "dunk" a 704? I fished them submerged for decades and only cleaned /  re-lubed / re-built every winter. Never had a problem and either did anyone else that I am aware of. The "dunking" issue is totally misunderstood or the newer reels are totally different. Never had a 704 fail ever.

I think the mystique of VS/ZB is so great that people turn a blind eye towards reels like the Penn.

 

I'll admit that I fish VS's out of day to day convenience however I own and use 704z because VS's do fail, and usually need to be sent away for service or repair. On the other hand I can tear down the Penn with a single screwdriver, replace any worn parts myselft and put the reel back into rotation with ease. They are a great reel to keep around on standby.

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36 mins ago, Sandbar1 said:

I think the mystique of VS/ZB is so great that people turn a blind eye towards reels like the Penn.

 

I'll admit that I fish VS's out of day to day convenience however I own and use 704z because VS's do fail, and usually need to be sent away for service or repair. On the other hand I can tear down the Penn with a single screwdriver, replace any worn parts myselft and put the reel back into rotation with ease. They are a great reel to keep around on standby.

I think I need a 704z for this reason alone.  

 

"60's Batman Noises!"  "To the Googler!!"  

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Posted (edited) · Report post

I learned on a VS200 BUT, afterwards I got into the Penn Z series. As said above they are excellent reels. 

A few things; 1. Once I fully immersed myself in bailess going  back to a bailed reel was a PIA. 2. The Mitchell bailess kit for the 704 could be tough to find. 3. I always felt the angle of the pick-up on the 704 is wrong. It sits parallel to the rotor, where the 706 & the VS/ZB are offset- makes for easier p/u IMHO. 

I'd go with the 706Z. Couple of pics of my 706Z (still in rotation) and my 710 (which I no longer own).

 

Penn 706Z.jpg

Penn 710.JPG

Edited by DonLBI

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 if you want bailess why convert a 704 ? just get a 706 and be done with it. my back up is a 710 bailess as i feel that is all the reel i need but to each his own   i agree with all the positive quotes above.  good luck

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I learned to fish bailess on a 706Z. It really doesn’t take that long to get used to making the motion and form muscle memory. I think you’ll be able to pick it up during your first session and do it naturally by your second time out. 
 

A converted 704z would work just as well to learn on and use.


Staying on a budget today- I would still use a Penn 706Z, 704Z as well as a converted 710Z.
 

 

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6 hours ago, SC said:

The rotor only spins if the reel is timed poorly or untimed. The grease is the right solution for a different problem but doesn't fix the handle from spinning during a cast it only masks the problem in my opinion. The handle shouldn't spin with or without grease.

So what do you mean when you say "timed"  This is my first year with bailess spinfisher and really love is but I have to be careful of the position of the handle before casting so it doesn't spin

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Started with a Mitchel 306 converted to MUP, and still fish it. Have Penn 704s converted, both greenies & Zs, as well as 706s. As well as Penn Spinfishers bailless, and Van Stalls. Rarely use anything with a bail.

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Posted (edited) · Report post

1 hour ago, Foureel said:

So what do you mean when you say "timed"  This is my first year with bailess spinfisher and really love is but I have to be careful of the position of the handle before casting so it doesn't spin

Ya answered your own question well done . 
 

it refers to the the handle position in relation to spool position .  Ideally spool full extended up and handle pointing down 

Edited by Wire For Fire

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Great information fellas, from what I am reading the consensus sounds like a Penn Z would be the best bang for the buck...Longevity, usability and maintenance wise. If they are anything like their big “greenie” brother, I should be all set. The Z is more $  vs the spinfisher but, I am willing to spend a little more to get more.

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