faithless

Can a business owner restrict access to public stocked waters?

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One of my favorite access to launch a kayak has been closed yesterday. I noticed during covid people would come there in droves with kayaks, boats and canoes. It was a very well hidden area that only a local would know about where you can slip in a kayak and not bother anyone. I guess it blew up on the internet as I saw people fishing that spot going to work every damn day. Every morning there would be someone there. This is a public water that is stocked by NJ for pike and bass in that exact spot. There are stocking notices posted on trees at the spot. It was never an issue for the last 7-8 years. All of the sudden there are no trespassing, no fishing, no boating (including inflatables) and some bogus signs be aware of wild life (alligators and snakes). Also signs with under surveillance. There are at least 5-6 signs spread apart in the area.

 

There are businesses backing the access. There is plenty of parking and it does not bother any business flow from people to launch there. The signs were most likely posted by the land owner because I don't see how any business could give a damn. You are literally parking in dirt by dumpsters away from everyone. Is this legal to restrict access to stocked public NJ waters? Who would I need to call to make sure this is legal?

 

It really pisses me off, this is 3 access points I have lost in the last 3 years to the same body of public water.

 

 

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Also is it legal to post these signs without a permit or permission from township? I am assuming someone would have to approve this.

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7 mins ago, faithless said:

 Is this legal to restrict access to stocked public NJ waters?

Yes!  Happened on a popular section of a river I fish this season due to the excessive amount of stocking season scumbags showing up when the gov. shut down state parks. Private access open for decades, owner a personal friend. He just got tired of the foul language, people urinating in his back yard & leaving trash behind.

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Yes.  There is no right to park on or to cross private land to access public fresh water. 

 

The "no boating" part is BS if it is public water.  But in some places, the land owner also owns the stream/lake bed... you can float over it, but you can't get out and wade it.

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I saw that too, been launching my kayak there for 15 years.
I was trying to see if the state stocked from that "access" point, I don't remember seeing stocking signs there.

This severely limits access to a large portion of the river, I know of some others in the area that are posted too.
I have to imagine that some jack ass did something to prompt these signs going up.

 

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On 7/4/2020 at 2:18 PM, faithless said:

Also is it legal to post these signs without a permit or permission from township? I am assuming someone would have to approve this.

 

The only thing that can restrict fishing, hunting, or trapping on a public waterway is the state of NJ Div of Fish game and wildlife.  A town cannot make game laws.  Period.    You can ignore no fishing, no hunting, and no trapping signs put up by landowners or those who proclaim to be landowners (*incidentally not uncommon).    You cannot ignore No trespassing signs.  

 

Towns/businesses can only restrict access to get to the water, not the water itself nor the wildlife in it.   If it says no fishing you can ignore it unless the State DivFGW put it there. 

 

No trespassing is iffy, especially if you are fishing the bank of state owned/public waterway.  You are kayaking, which means you are rtrespassing only for the time it takes to portage and launch.  How long will you be actually trespassing to get there?  3 minutes?  Bottom line is it will come down to what the local LEO do/say about it. 

 

No parking?  Well within the right of the property owner.  Thats the one that can get you towed and cost$$.   From a practical sense, thats the only sign that matters to the kayaker.  

 

Loss of access for outdoor sporting activities (and the consequential funneling of these activities into increasingly smaller and denser areas is a huge priblem in NJ.  Huge.  

 

I'm not a lawyer nor a Wildlife LEO, but I did sit in on some classes, which gets you what you paid for this.  

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On 7/4/2020 at 2:27 PM, SB59 said:

Add on. You must own it to post it. Posting land you don't own or lease is a crime.

 

It is extremely common in NNJ.  People post land that isnt theirs all the time.  The Great Meadows and surrounding area is (or at least was) rife with it.  

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17 mins ago, 55555s said:

 

It is extremely common in NNJ.  People post land that isnt theirs all the time.  The Great Meadows and surrounding area is (or at least was) rife with it.  

Very common

First question you need to answer is "who owns the posted property" 

If it's private, how is the state accessing it to stock? They stock from publicly owned property, town, county, state, or federal.

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2 hours ago, techyakker said:

I saw that too, been launching my kayak there for 15 years.
I was trying to see if the state stocked from that "access" point, I don't remember seeing stocking signs there.

This severely limits access to a large portion of the river, I know of some others in the area that are posted too.
I have to imagine that some jack ass did something to prompt these signs going up.

 

They used to post them up on the tree all the way to right at the main drop in. I have pics of it somewhere I took a while ago. 

 

I am really bitter about it. People are ignoring the signs already as I saw a fleet of kayaks being launched yesterday. It has to be posted on some forum or app because I haven't seen any of these people before. A lot of PA and NY plates too have been showing up.

 

 

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2 mins ago, Sudsy said:

Very common

First question you need to answer is "who owns the posted property" 

If it's private, how is the state accessing it to stock? They stock from publicly owned property, town, county, state, or federal.

They are stocking right where the access point is on a private property in the back of some businesses.

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This is the sign posted right at the launch for the last couple years. Not sure if it is there now. It was always exactly at the access point on the tree to the right. 

 

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Posted (edited) · Report post

How can it be a "Public Access" point tht the state uses to stock if it's private property ?

If it is private property the owner is within his rights to post it but the state wouldn't stock there

A few things here are not adding up

 

Edited by Sudsy

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30 mins ago, Sudsy said:

How can it be a "Public Access" point tht the state uses to stock if it's private property ?

If it is private property the owner is within his rights to post it but the state wouldn't stock there

A few things here are not adding up

 

This is why I'm posting here for opinions because to me it doesn't make sense. I think the landowner just went rogue because he saw that there are too many people coming so he took it upon himself to post all of the signs everywhere. However, if it is stocked there then that gives him no right.

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Find out who the landowner is.  If you have the address it's likely on zillow with property lines.  Theres very likely al right of way, in which case landowner can go scratch.

 

 

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