Ajefferslyon

I have a crazy idea: use a spinning rod for fly casting

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Here are the idea ingredients:  I love two handed fly rods & want more.  Problem: they are expensive.  I know there are alot of spinning/surf casting rods out there that are cheap.  Fly rods are basically rated for the weight of the line they can throw.  Spin rods are rated for the weight of the lure they can throw.  Both are bendy graphite poles.  Why couldn't I get a 12 foot surf casting rod rated for 1.5oz plugs and then RIP long casts with 700 grain scandi heads?  

 

Yes the butt would be too long.  Yes the guides would be big.  But saving $700 is a big factor too.    

 

Would love to hear your thoughts.  

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A blank is a blank, it's not like it's going to go floppy on you because you're throwing fly lines instead of plugs.

 

I've built 3 fly rods on spin blanks. There's no difference, save the name of the type of blank. That's all.

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I'm a little embarrassed to have started this thread since I just realized you guys are way ahead of me on this.  So much info in the "Two Handed Rods for the salt" thread.    This Forum is awesome.  I have much to learn from you all.  Thank you guys in advance for all the info I'm about to absorb.  

 

Red, do you have any blanks you'd suggest?  I'm looking for distance of course.  And if it could throw lines in the 600 to 800 gn range that would be awesome.  (really can't afford to buy more lines to fit a rod)

 

 

32 mins ago, RedGreen said:

A blank is a blank, it's not like it's going to go floppy on you because you're throwing fly lines instead of plugs.

 

I've built 3 fly rods on spin blanks. There's no difference, save the name of the type of blank. That's all.

 

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Go to the 2 handed rods for the salt postings.

Mucho info on some of the blanks that you can build plus Mike Oliver's recent post about carp rods.

 

 Suggest you also research the Common Cents System.

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Posted (edited) · Report post

A genuine 1.5 Oz rated spin rod will not handle 600 grains. You are  looking at a rating of close to 1 to 3 Oz.

 

One aspect of experimenting is that you can end up spending way more money      
in total. Hate to think how much your 30 fly lines cost you. Way more than an outfit that would work well.

 

I had to go down this path about twelve years ago . It was incredibly expensive.

 

If distance is your key parameter then think around 13 feet and 600 to 700 grains capability. The rod must have reserves of power. We do not match lines to TH rods like we do to Single handers.

 

In realistic terms a good caster in a friendly cross wind will reach out to 100 feet comfortably. 130 feet is on the cards  to depending  on the ground we are standing on and any obstructions that could impede us.

We will not hit close to these ranges with wind in our face. No matter if you are a world champ. In spite of what is often said there have been enough occasions when fish could only be reached with a big cast.

These are measured not estimated . Huge difference.
 

Mike

Edited by Mike Oliver

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OP,

 

Don't be embarrassed. It's a massive thread, it's a lot of info to take in. We all start in different places.

 

If you're looking to throw 600-800 grains I know of one blank that can do that very well. It's a 14' fly rod blank, 4pc. Stout as hell. Costly, but there's nothing else on the planet like it. Worth every penny.

 

The other options for lines approaching 800 grains are surf and carp blanks. Harrison makes a few 13' blanks that could work, but I've never handled these so they could be s***, spectacular, or anywhere in between. I've been curious about them for quite a while, but my 14'er hasn't left me wanting anything, so I haven't pursued them further.

 

Basically your choice is cost. What is your stance on funding this project?

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Daiwa Ardito 5 piece Medium 11' surf rod will cost you ~$90 and get you to 600g or a bit above.  Not the Medium Heavy version as it's too stiff.

 

Esa at this site likes the NGT travel carp rod blank and it is cheap but hard to find in the U.S.  Both he and I think 11' is ideal but some prefer longer.  I have the Beulah 9/10 surf rod to compare it to and the Ardito is around 1-2 line weight classes above it.  My conversion was inexpensive because I just added a Fuji reel seat to the existing handle.  Crude, yet effective.

 

In 2 piece I think I would look at any of the 2.75 test curve carp rods or else the Okuma Rockaway Surf in 12' 1-4 oz or 11' 1-4 oz.  The blanks are light and the cost is minimal - again around $90 per rod.  The tips on these blanks are fast and somewhat thin but they hold up.  I wouldn't attempt to cut them, just use as is.  I have the 11' 1-4 and it has all the characteristics of a 10/11wt TH rod (although I haven't measured it in common cents terms).

Edited by Killiefish

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On 6/11/2020 at 5:02 PM, Ajefferslyon said:

Here are the idea ingredients:  I love two handed fly rods & want more.  Problem: they are expensive.  I know there are alot of spinning/surf casting rods out there that are cheap.  Fly rods are basically rated for the weight of the line they can throw.  Spin rods are rated for the weight of the lure they can throw.  Both are bendy graphite poles.  Why couldn't I get a 12 foot surf casting rod rated for 1.5oz plugs and then RIP long casts with 700 grain scandi heads?  

 

Yes the butt would be too long.  Yes the guides would be big.  But saving $700 is a big factor too.    

 

Would love to hear your thoughts.  

you can make any spining rod to work as Two handed fly rod,you do not have to modyfie anythink.the reel seat is perfect where is for spioning rod.only what you have to find out is maximum load for rod,this way you use proper shooting head to operate rod nice and easy.

put fly reel where is spining reel,and to the and off fly line put shooting head and cast in field.

to make shooting head for practise and find maximum load for rod.

make shooting head from nylon roap 1/4" to 3/8",one 600 grain,two 200 grain,two 100 grain,make them on scale.

1.put on 600 grain cast,ad 200 grain,ad 100 grain,this way you find maximum load for your rod.

you can use 1 rod for spining and Two hand fly rod.it work perfect you just change reel.

first when you put fly reel on that it look wierd,but when you field cast for week,1 hour a day,you learn properly manage the line,you will like that.

after this casting when you grab regular fly rod ,you will not like that any more.

 

i find all this by axident,i ordered 12' spining rod and my plan was to strip the rod and make that Two handed rod,but for some reason i put fly reel on that and 725 grain shooting head and went casting to field,first the look and fieling was wierd but after 5 day casting i dicided i like that as is,reason operate beter then fly rod much easier.

even fishing smaal streem i prefer fish my  Two handed rod.

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On 6/12/2020 at 9:21 AM, RedGreen said:

OP,

 

Don't be embarrassed. It's a massive thread, it's a lot of info to take in. We all start in different places.

 

If you're looking to throw 600-800 grains I know of one blank that can do that very well. It's a 14' fly rod blank, 4pc. Stout as hell. Costly, but there's nothing else on the planet like it. Worth every penny.

 

The other options for lines approaching 800 grains are surf and carp blanks. Harrison makes a few 13' blanks that could work, but I've never handled these so they could be s***, spectacular, or anywhere in between. I've been curious about them for quite a while, but my 14'er hasn't left me wanting anything, so I haven't pursued them further.

 

Basically your choice is cost. What is your stance on funding this project?

Thanks so much for the info Red.  As for cost - I'm looking to get a cheaper one for now ($100-$300) and then hopefully by this winter I will have enough saved to splurge on whatever is the best/stoutest TH rod - no price restrictions.   So I'm very curious about this 14' blank...might it be the one from Mike Oliver?  As for those carp rods...I will check them out.  When outfitting for a flyrod set up, do you guys always start with blanks?  Having little time and patience (for now at least) is there any serious problem with just buying the completed carp/surf rod and throwing the reel on?  The larger guides can't be THAT big of an issue right?

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18 hours ago, snag777 said:

you can make any spining rod to work as Two handed fly rod,you do not have to modyfie anythink.the reel seat is perfect where is for spioning rod.only what you have to find out is maximum load for rod,this way you use proper shooting head to operate rod nice and easy.

put fly reel where is spining reel,and to the and off fly line put shooting head and cast in field.

to make shooting head for practise and find maximum load for rod.

make shooting head from nylon roap 1/4" to 3/8",one 600 grain,two 200 grain,two 100 grain,make them on scale.

1.put on 600 grain cast,ad 200 grain,ad 100 grain,this way you find maximum load for your rod.

you can use 1 rod for spining and Two hand fly rod.it work perfect you just change reel.

first when you put fly reel on that it look wierd,but when you field cast for week,1 hour a day,you learn properly manage the line,you will like that.

after this casting when you grab regular fly rod ,you will not like that any more.

 

i find all this by axident,i ordered 12' spining rod and my plan was to strip the rod and make that Two handed rod,but for some reason i put fly reel on that and 725 grain shooting head and went casting to field,first the look and fieling was wierd but after 5 day casting i dicided i like that as is,reason operate beter then fly rod much easier.

even fishing smaal streem i prefer fish my  Two handed rod.

Thank you so much for the intel!  Was JUST wondering about the guides/reel seat as I don't have time to wrap up my own rod at the moment.  May I ask what 12' spinning rod you purchased?  Also, great idea with the rope for testing.  Just got myself a scale so will def try this.  

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On 6/13/2020 at 0:25 PM, Killiefish said:

Daiwa Ardito 5 piece Medium 11' surf rod will cost you ~$90 and get you to 600g or a bit above.  Not the Medium Heavy version as it's too stiff.

 

Esa at this site likes the NGT travel carp rod blank and it is cheap but hard to find in the U.S.  Both he and I think 11' is ideal but some prefer longer.  I have the Beulah 9/10 surf rod to compare it to and the Ardito is around 1-2 line weight classes above it.  My conversion was inexpensive because I just added a Fuji reel seat to the existing handle.  Crude, yet effective.

 

In 2 piece I think I would look at any of the 2.75 test curve carp rods or else the Okuma Rockaway Surf in 12' 1-4 oz or 11' 1-4 oz.  The blanks are light and the cost is minimal - again around $90 per rod.  The tips on these blanks are fast and somewhat thin but they hold up.  I wouldn't attempt to cut them, just use as is.  I have the 11' 1-4 and it has all the characteristics of a 10/11wt TH rod (although I haven't measured it in common cents terms).

Thank you!

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2 hours ago, Ajefferslyon said:

Thanks so much for the info Red.  As for cost - I'm looking to get a cheaper one for now ($100-$300) and then hopefully by this winter I will have enough saved to splurge on whatever is the best/stoutest TH rod - no price restrictions.   So I'm very curious about this 14' blank...might it be the one from Mike Oliver?  As for those carp rods...I will check them out.  When outfitting for a flyrod set up, do you guys always start with blanks?  Having little time and patience (for now at least) is there any serious problem with just buying the completed carp/surf rod and throwing the reel on?  The larger guides can't be THAT big of an issue right?

Yes, it's an Oliver rod. You should PM him for more information if you're considering picking one up.

 

As for using a spin rod directly as a fly rod, aside from the reel being in a weird place and the guides being a bit different it should work just fine. I wouldn't leave the rod like that, id strip the guides off and the handle too, make it a new one with reel seat in the more typical location, with a better guide set. Probably titanium silicon carbide guides, all single foots (stripper too, you do not need double foots on any fly rod) . Torzites if I wanted more space to clear a fly line. SiC size 8 are big enough to pass 750 grains of floating shooting head no problem.

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In a way, using a bucktail jig is a very limited form of fishing a fly with a spinning rod. I am sure some of the large flies people are tying and throwing with two hand rods could be thrown on a spinning rod and worked correctly too. I use a diamond jig to cast and work flies all the time.

I'll have to dig into the two hand thread. 

I have been hesitant to try heavy fly rods in the surf for this reason. I will probably just stick with my single hand 9wt for calm surf and flats fishing.

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