drmevo

Face shield/gaiter/whatever as a mask

32 posts in this topic

Is anyone planning to use their kayaking face shield as a mask in day-to-day life if you need to go out in public? I have a few and seeing as how they’re UV protective I wonder if that means they’re better at filtering droplets as well.   I saw one article saying any fabric that blocks light well is ideal.
For me it’s more of a curiosity as I don’t plan to go to any stores or be around others besides my immediate family, and even if I did I have a P100 respirator I could use. But maybe it’s a good alternative to buying/making a basic mask?

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2 hours ago, drmevo said:

Is anyone planning to use their kayaking face shield as a mask in day-to-day life if you need to go out in public? I have a few and seeing as how they’re UV protective I wonder if that means they’re better at filtering droplets as well.   I saw one article saying any fabric that blocks light well is ideal.
For me it’s more of a curiosity as I don’t plan to go to any stores or be around others besides my immediate family, and even if I did I have a P100 respirator I could use. But maybe it’s a good alternative to buying/making a basic mask?

I actually though about this too. I'm not sure what kind of protection the masks would provide but work may start requiring us to wear some type of face covering and these would be the most comfortable option. If work requires some type of certified protection I will have to go with that.

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They do n-o-t-h-i-n-g to protect you, just makes people feel like they're 'safe'. Sh-- even half the surgical masks dont do anything. Watch aerosol tests on them, it's kinda scary. N95 and one other (model escapes me right now) will protect against viruses. 

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6 hours ago, EricM said:

When someone farts and you breathe through your t-shirt, do you expect it to help? 

Do farts travel in water droplets?

4 hours ago, ThrowinPlugs said:

They do n-o-t-h-i-n-g to protect you, just makes people feel like they're 'safe'. Sh-- even half the surgical masks dont do anything. Watch aerosol tests on them, it's kinda scary. N95 and one other (model escapes me right now) will protect against viruses. 

Nothing? No, that flies in the face of all the information out there now. It’s  about stopping more of the droplets coming out of the wearer anyways, but the point is, they do something. Like I said, I’ll take my P100, which filters 100% of particles if I need it, but not everyone has one. From NBC News:

 

If you are making your own covering, new research finds that some fabrics are better than others at filtering out viral particles.

"You have to use relatively high-quality cloth," Dr. Scott Segal, chair of anesthesiology at Wake Forest Baptist Health in Winston-Salem, North Carolina, said.

Face coverings made of fabric, public health experts note, aren't intended to protect wearers from getting sick, but rather, to prevent them from spreading the virus to others. And the guidance will still exclude using surgical or medical grade masks, which experts say should be reserved for people who are sick and for the health care workers who care for them.

Segal came up with the idea to study which fabrics would work best.

In partnership with the Wake Forest Institute for Regenerative Medicine, he tested a variety of cloth materials to see which ones not only allowed for breathability, but also filtered small particles — such as viruses. The research from Wake Forest has not been submitted for publication and has not been peer-reviewed.

On the left, researchers used a special filtration test to determine how many small particles were blocked with a variety of masks and fabrics. On the right, a piece of cloth lets light shine through easily, signalling a lower quality fabric.Courtesy of Wake Forest Baptist Health

To test various masks and fabrics, the team pumped air through both types of face coverings.

"Our instruments could read down to 0.3 microns, which is about the size of a big virus," Segal said.

Regular surgical masks filtered out 62 percent to 65 percent of particles. For comparison, N95 masks filter 95 percent of those particles.

But the fabrics led to a variety of results. One piece of cloth filtered just 1 percent of particles, rendering it virtually useless, while others were found to perform even better than the surgical masks.

"We had some that performed at 79 percent," Segal told NBC News.

The best masks were constructed of two layers of heavyweight "quilters cotton" with a thread count of at least 180, and had thicker and tighter weave.

Lesser quality fabrics also worked well, as long as they had an internal layer of flannel.

"You do want to use a woven fabric, like batik," Segal said, "but you don't want to use a knit fabric, because the holes between the knit stitches are bigger."

In other words, if the fabric allows for a substantial amount of light to shine through, it's probably going to allow tiny viral particles through, as well.

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4 hours ago, ThrowinPlugs said:

Watch aerosol tests on them, it's kinda scary. 

 

It would be if the coronavirus is truly aerosolized, but it's not; it travels in droplets. And surgical masks are very effective at stopping droplets. Even charcoal masks and scarves go a long way to mitigate droplets.

 

7 hours ago, drmevo said:

Is anyone planning to use their kayaking face shield as a mask in day-to-day life if you need to go out in public?

 

Some masks (Simms, Aftco) have breathing holes cut into them...obviously these are no bueno. I'd imagine you'd want the opposite of breathability for corona purposes lol.

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The mask is NOT to protect you, but protect others FROM you ... if you cough or sneeze into a mask it will limit the amount of droplets to be released, in theory cutting down the spread of the virus. because the evidence is pointing toward asymptomatic individuals actually carrying the virus, they want everyone in public to have a mask.

 

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Masks need to be N95 or better to block the virus. Anything else- bandanas, buffs, cloth masks are a false sense of security. N95 is 0.3 microns, your buff/bandana is nowhere near that. Think of your buff/bandana as a volleyball net, droplets are the volleyball, the net stops them. Bacteria are golf balls and viruses are marbles...throw each of those at a volleyball net and what happens?  The virus is transmitted through the air, which is why hospitals are taking airborne precautions, not droplet precautions. 

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30 mins ago, jeffreyrichard said:

The mask is NOT to protect you, but protect others FROM you ... if you cough or sneeze into a mask it will limit the amount of droplets to be released, in theory cutting down the spread of the virus. because the evidence is pointing toward asymptomatic individuals actually carrying the virus, they want everyone in public to have a mask.

 

 

23 mins ago, BeachBum818 said:

Masks need to be N95 or better to block the virus. Anything else- bandanas, buffs, cloth masks are a false sense of security. N95 is 0.3 microns, your buff/bandana is nowhere near that. Think of your buff/bandana as a volleyball net, droplets are the volleyball, the net stops them. Bacteria are golf balls and viruses are marbles...throw each of those at a volleyball net and what happens?  The virus is transmitted through the air, which is why hospitals are taking airborne precautions, not droplet precautions. 

This is what I was getting at.

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Posted (edited) · Report post

41 mins ago, jeffreyrichard said:

The mask is NOT to protect you, but protect others FROM you ... if you cough or sneeze into a mask it will limit the amount of droplets to be released, in theory cutting down the spread of the virus. because the evidence is pointing toward asymptomatic individuals actually carrying the virus, they want everyone in public to have a mask.

 

Yeah, my post above says that. 
 

 

34 mins ago, BeachBum818 said:

Masks need to be N95 or better to block the virus. Anything else- bandanas, buffs, cloth masks are a false sense of security. N95 is 0.3 microns, your buff/bandana is nowhere near that. Think of your buff/bandana as a volleyball net, droplets are the volleyball, the net stops them. Bacteria are golf balls and viruses are marbles...throw each of those at a volleyball net and what happens?  The virus is transmitted through the air, which is why hospitals are taking airborne precautions, not droplet precautions. 

Yes, I think we all get this by now. I never said the primary function of such a covering was to protect the wearer. I don’t think anyone paying attention thinks a cloth mask is as effective as an N95, but explain why the CDC is advising they are a good idea if they don’t do anything? Did you read what I quoted? A new study showed not all cloth is equal and some cloth can block nearly 80% of particles. Surely that’s better than nothing? By the way, the droplets ARE airborne when someone coughs, sneezes or breathes, so I’m not sure what your last sentence means. 

Edited by drmevo

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Here’s some info on UVP clothing that seems to support what I’m talking about, when taken in the context of the first article I posted:


“Most fabrics that we wear are a loose weave that lets visible light peek through and get to our skin. With UPF-protected clothes, the weave is different and often times is made from a special fabric to help form a barrier against the sun’s rays.”

UV light can penetrate through the micro holes in the weaves of regular clothes or can even travel directly through a light-colored shirt. With UPF clothing, the block is much greater, giving you more protection from the sun.

Most sun protection clothing looks and feels like active wear or athleisure and comes in a variety of shirts, leggings and hats. And because of the higher thread count, it often feels a little more luxurious vs. your standard T-shirt.“

 

Hypothetically, if I HAD to go out to a store and didn’t have my P100 mask, I think I’d be wearing two of my UVP face shields together. 

Edited by drmevo

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Look at footage from China around any of their respiratory virus outbreaks,  they all have masks not  bandanas around their face.....

 

Our government has been trying to get the public to forgo masks for quite awhile,  hoarders in this country take away the supply,  i get it... seems like they want the public to get on a different band wagon & i think they're succeeding (to some degree)

 

I'm guessing China has never had  a shortage....

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15 mins ago, drmevo said:

Yeah, my post above says that. 
 

 

Yes, I think we all get this by now. I never said the primary function of such a covering was to protect the wearer. I don’t think anyone paying attention thinks a cloth mask is as effective as an N95, but explain why the CDC is advising they are a good idea if they don’t do anything? Did you read what I quoted? A new study showed not all cloth is equal and some cloth can block nearly 80% of particles. Surely that’s better than nothing? By the way, the droplets ARE airborne when someone coughs, sneezes or breathes, so I’m not sure what your last sentence means. 

The CDC originally was against non-medical grade face masks, and the EU CDC still is, due to the sense of false sense of safety. Now the CDC is for it because they dont have the medical grade masks they thought they had. 80% of particles, not viruses. If bacteria are golf balls viruses can range from marbles down to the smallest ball bearings. Covid-19 is one of those small ball bearings. 

 

Droplets are NOT airborne.  Go to any ICU in the US and you'll find that droplet and airborne precautions are 2 totally separate issues with their own measures of PPE and safety. (the third precaution being contact) Droplets travel short distances and don't linger in the air. This is an airborne virus, not a droplet virus. It travels much further and hangs in the air way longer than any droplet. Now thats not saying it cant be transmitted via droplet, but that's not the primary means of transport. Airborne is the most serious of the 3 precautions. 

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15 mins ago, drmevo said:

Here’s some info on UVP clothing that seems to support what I’m talking about, when taken in the context of the first article I posted:


“Most fabrics that we wear are a loose weave that lets visible light peek through and get to our skin. With UPF-protected clothes, the weave is different and often times is made from a special fabric to help form a barrier against the sun’s rays.”

UV light can penetrate through the micro holes in the weaves of regular clothes or can even travel directly through a light-colored shirt. With UPF clothing, the block is much greater, giving you more protection from the sun.

Most sun protection clothing looks and feels like active wear or athleisure and comes in a variety of shirts, leggings and hats. And because of the higher thread count, it often feels a little more luxurious vs. your standard T-shirt.“

 

Hypothetically, if I HAD to go out to a store and didn’t have my P100 mask, I think I’d be wearing two of my UVP face shields together. 

How many sunburns have you had through regular clothing? Regular clothing still creates tanlines. UV protective clothing is all about marketing, nothing more. It's even more funny when they put a rating on it- UPF 30 or UPF 50... sunscren ratings are for reapplying the lotion/spray. You cant reapply a shirt after wearing it for a certain amount of time. Even the cheapest of T-shirts will create tanlines and you wont burn through them

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