frazerp

New Blank for the Two-Handed Crew

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North Fork Composites has a 14', 4 pc 9 wt. blank for $150 + $35 S&H + $10 Excise – $195
While I need another blank to build this winter like a hole in the head - wonder what the crew thinks or knows

 

Fly Blanks are 40T and 50T carbon blands (sic)
Ferrule Lite Joints (can replace sections without needing to send the original blank)
Matte X-Ray Finish
Armor Resin: Toughener added to the pre-preg resin to prevent micro-cracks and crack propagation caused by fly on blank impacts
LMX 14’0 4pc  9/10 weight Fast Action Fly (Spey)

 

NFC's SKU of FASY1409-4 is similar to Red/Green's build of the Pac Bay FASY1409-4 ???

PS: There is also a 15' available - another $35 

 

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Funny how the serial no. is exactly the same. Could mean something or nothing. 

 

If nobody bites we'll never know. 

 

It's a 100% shot in the dark as they don't list the blanks weight so it's hard to get a good idea how how powerful it is. A 14' TH blank for out front should weigh around 7 ounces when made of high quality pre-preg. 

 

IIRC, the pac bay 14' 9wt weighed a bit below 6.5 ounces, and while crap at 14' was a very workable with an approximate foot cut off the tip to bring it to 13'. 

 

My stance on these is my default when there's not enough info. They probably won't cut it. Chance that's the case is very high. But if you never try you'll never know. 

 

Personally I say just save up and get one of Mike Oliver's blanks. They just work. 

 

But if you're feeling adventurous, you could take the plunge and see how these north fork spey blanks are. 

 

If you do pull the trigger let us know how much the blank weighs and how it feels. It should be very "poky" and stiff. 

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The biggest clue can be the description. If it is a spey blank then It is unlikely to be ideal for open beach fishing.

A spey blank is designed for spey casting in fresh water.

I have yet to find one that is suitable for the surf. They are two very different blanks.

I would never take my own TH surf fly rod and use it on rivers. It would be terrible and it cuts both ways.

Much better options for low cost blanks have been discussed many times but as a reminder carp blanks and some spin blanks can make very good TH surf fly. But mostly are two piece. You do need to know what you are looking for in a blank. They don’t have to be low cost either as hi end carp blanks are also good contenders. The natural human condition is always to go low to start with.

By the time you have gone through three or four builds it gets expensive in money and time if you try and get none specific designs to work. 
I have been there and done that. It was not even fun.

 

Mike

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*  Check this out . 

She cast a single handed rod 161 feet! She is also a champion with the two handed rod.

It all about the technique rather than the rod. FishHawk

Edited by TimS
Please don't post commercial links here - thanks

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On 12/18/2019 at 7:18 PM, FishHawk II said:

* Check this out . 

She cast a single handed rod 161 feet! She is also a champion with the two handed rod.

It all about the technique rather than the rod. FishHawk

FishHawk II.

I got to see Maxine cast in the last world championships along with the rest of the American team. She is outstanding. But I bet you your last cent she would not have been casting any old stick.

The sea presents different problems to solve than rivers, I wished so much that rod design or choice was of no importance. Twelve or is it fifteen years experience  has shown me that we can’t just go and take a spey rod designed for rivers and    
get the performance we would like on the beach. I tried it and it did not take long to realise the limitations.

I wonder how many guys had their prejudice against TH reinforced after following the often offered advice to try what they had and then found it just plain disappointed. That is a great pity. Very few guys pursue TH Out Front with the same intensity of those who fish single handers. It is outside most guys comfort zone and it takes initially a fair bit of determination to follow through that initial interest.

Mike   

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2 hours ago, frazerp said:

Might actually be the rod - which blank & who built it ???

 

PS: Goin to ask NFC if they did any CCS on the blank I mentioned ...

CCS is very useful but is only part of the story.

 

The only way you are going to be able to asses suitability is to get one in your hands.

The PAC Bay blank that RedGreen took a punt on worked but only after taking a saw and reducing it from the tip end. How many guys have the stomach for that. I have cast Reds PAC bay and it’s good and not expensive. He got very lucky. But made his luck as is as driven as me in looking for solutions to fish well out front in conditions that are not always fair. Even moderate conditions are challenging due to waves and breaking waves and white water. I have always said that a good single hand rod will be better than an unsuitable TH out front.

If you do take the plunge please let us know the outcome.

 

mike

Edited by Mike Oliver

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Put Maxine McCormick on an outer cape beach and then let's talk. 

 

Comp casting obviously requires a lot of skill but there are idealizations made for castings sake. It's just not the same as casting when fishing, especially in salt water where our flies are bigger than a quarter sized piece of fluff. 

 

That said, those comp casters (some of them) have figured out what Mike has been talking about for years and myself for less so. TH rods for overhead casting need to be very stiff, much stiffer than spey rods. If you look at Steve Rajeff's TH casting, you'll see the kind of rods we use. They hardly bend at all to the line's weight, and are fully capable of moving that line as fast as the caster wants without slowing down. 

 

In fly fishing technique is mostly everything, except when it isn't. This is one of those "except when it isn't" cases. If you bring an ordinary spey rod out front and expect it to handle typical out front type weather, you're going to be let down. Here you need mass and speed to fly fish meaningfully. When a 10wt gets blown off not even Maxine McCormick or Steve Rajeff will be able to make it work. That's where the TH solution comes in. Lots more mass and more line speed means you can still fish when a 10wt wielded by anyone is blown away. That's not to say you don't need technique, you do, but you don't have to be a comp caster to make the TH solution work for you. But your gear has to be purpose driven. Not pressed into some use it wasn't made for. 

Edited by RedGreen

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Hi Red,

 

If you put any of the world comp casters onto a beach with the right tool they would simply excel. It is true that the casting court where possible is arranged so they cast with a tail wind and from an elevated platform and casting just fluff so it is very different to fishing.

But the loop size and line speed and control these guys and gals have is just mind blowing.  If they wanted to come to the surf they would be fantastic.

I agree with you on the gear we use. Been through that wringer for too long not to. But it is very difficult to get it accepted by most guys. Unless the skeptical come and try it out, When Herb and myself ran the TH days in Cape Cod some guys really got it but not that many continued why I don’t know.

 Very true that you don’t have to be a fantastic caster to stay fishing with a TH when it gets a bit tough although it helps. LOL.

It is sadly just not mainstream.

 

mike

 

Edited by Mike Oliver

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Of course Mike, I'm not at all disputing their skill.

 

But you did say it yourself in the first sentence of your reply. "With the right tool". Those comp guys understand that no problem. If they don't, they don't get to compete because they just can't. Why people don't understand that there is a right and wrong tool I don't get.

 

Honestly I don't care if it's mainstream or not. It's less people out there when it's "too windy" to fish, so more water for myself. Usually I prefer solitude when I fish these days.

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Red I know your not. Just  re inforcing how good these Competition casters are in case we get misunderstood.

It always bothered me that a great many guys would have no problem using and promoting the right gear for all aspects of fly fishing be it river or sea and lake but not when it came to TH for Out Front. Even more amazing when we consider just how few actually do it so how can these guys have any kind of qualified opinion. Or their experience is based on gear that is not Out Front specific so their views can be unhelpful to others thinking about taking the plunge. I am talking generally now to put my post into context.

There will always be room on a beach after dark loads of it and in head winds during the day. You never need to worry about solitude even in today’s over populated world.

 

mike

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On 12/19/2019 at 7:06 PM, Mike Oliver said:

Hi Red,

 

If you put any of the world comp casters onto a beach with the right tool they would simply excel. It is true that the casting court where possible is arranged so they cast with a tail wind and from an elevated platform and casting just fluff so it is very different to fishing.

But the loop size and line speed and control these guys and gals have is just mind blowing.  If they wanted to come to the surf they would be fantastic.

I agree with you on the gear we use. Been through that wringer for too long not to. But it is very difficult to get it accepted by most guys. Unless the skeptical come and try it out, When Herb and myself ran the TH days in Cape Cod some guys really got it but not that many continued why I don’t know.

 Very true that you don’t have to be a fantastic caster to stay fishing with a TH when it gets a bit tough although it helps. LOL.

It is sadly just not mainstream.

 

mike

 

 

I could be the poster boy for that one :)

 

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I’ve been using a very roughly converted (added reel seat, one guide taped on) and cheap diawa 12 ft carp rod with 700-900 grains skagit for the last year. It absolutely bombs 100 + feet of line with a good cast but sometimes I question if it’s really fly fishing at that point lol. Fun as hell and addictive though! 

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1 hour ago, Mike Oliver said:

Me to HT.

 

These young blades have pushed ahead of us. It is how it should be.

They inspire me now. Funny ole world.

 

Mike

Yep,  DanTheBassMan's cast is something to aspire to  :)    He's been quiet of late, taking care of his education I hope.

HT

 

Edited by HillTop

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