drmevo

Trouble casting Airflo Ridge intermediate

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115 posts in this topic

17 hours ago, drmevo said:

Certainly a passionate group of folks here, which is mostly good I think, but no need to make a fuss over the whole thing. I’m catching fish on both lines so no major troubles to worry about on my end, just curiosity and always trying to improve. :)  

I'm also new to this forum... it's great, isn't it?! 

 

Wanted to mention one more thing to you... I also had an intermediate line that was giving me a little trouble until...

 

I had a happy accident happen last week. I mistakenly loaded up my 8wt. with a 6wt full sink line (I have a 6 and 8 of the same model and didn't look close enough while rigging). Anyway, I had a hell of a time casting and blamed it on the breeze and the fact that it was a cheap, crappy line. But I labored through it with an aggressive double haul, still not knowing the mistake I had made and eventually was getting 50 ft casts out. When I finished for the day, I broke down the rod and saw the bone-headed move I had made. What an idiot. 

 

BUT when I fished that intermediate line a couple days later, I had it dialed in. I had a slightly stronger double haul and was focused on properly - dare I say it - loading the rod, and that made all the difference.  Way underlining my rod kind of worked like a batting donut. Maybe doing something similar on purpose could help you? Has anyone else done this before? It's possible it could lead to other bad habits but it did the trick for me in this instance. 

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3 hours ago, 707steelnstripe said:

OK DR. "M." EVO, POP QUIZ: 

 

1. what causes tailing loops?

 

 

Probably trying to muscle your cast out there?

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I have cast heavy lines using soft rods and light lines using stiff rods to see the effect but also to learn cast better. Line weight has huge influence to casting distance. Line head length significant and rod effect is very small until rod becomes too soft for the cast line. Stiffer rod produce longer casts but stiffer rods are usually heavier and it eventually limits distance gain when rod require more force to accelerate. Heavy rod also leads to injuries sooner or later. I think for me it is the haul which efficiency gets better with stiffer rod because I can aerialize bit more line using not as stiff rod. In Trout Distance competition where SA MED WF5F line is cast I use Orvis Helios 9ft #10 rod because I like its light only 3.45oz (98g) weight.

 

Esa

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21 hours ago, drmevo said:

Probably trying to muscle your cast out there?

It can muscling early can lead to less of a load at end of cast leading to waves and loop I believe. 

 

Also muscling late can cause waves which can cause tailing loop. 

 

Anyways, when you said the airflo line was bunching up on you that's what made me think: does he know about the tailing loop. 

 

Be upstanding to the videos suggested by Crunch to learn more on top subject. 

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@crunch : in your estimable opinion, is it important that Dr. M. Evo know what cause his tailing loops? Or, do you agree with CPalms, that he just needs a shooting head style line??? 

 

Or do u agree with Mike Oliver that this thread has run its course and Doc Evo doesn't need anymore of our help because "Oly" is "fatigued" "bored" and "sleepy". 

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I fished both lines today on a late lunch break. Minimal wind, pretty ideal conditions. I had some good moments and some not so good moments, but overall things are getting better and I’m able to cast the lines more equally. When I really pay attention to keeping a tight loop either line does well. I like the thin, non-stretchy feel of the Airflo. The few times the wind did kick up it tended to affect the Airflo more than the Rio though. 

 

I didn’t catch any stripers, but I did catch a pretty big shad on the Airflo line, which was a blast. 

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If you can create good loops then start paying attention to always feeling and maintaining line tension with your line hand.   Some tension should always be present including at the finish of your backcast and start of your forward cast.  Many beginners loose tension by either throwing open sagging downward loops on their backcast or failing to maintain a constant distance between the collector guide and line hand as the rod starts forward.  If you loose that tension it means you've introduced slack into the line and your arm and rod motion will be squandered removing it before you can start moving the end of the fly line.    Casting into the wind actually helps with learning this since the wind helps blow slack out of your backcast.  Conversely, casting with a tailwind is counterproductive as it holds up the backcast (particularly a poor one) and makes it hard to maintain line tension unless you shorten your carry and consciously work to increase your line speed (hard for many of us).  

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2 hours ago, drmevo said:

I fished both lines today on a late lunch break. Minimal wind, pretty ideal conditions. I had some good moments and some not so good moments, but overall things are getting better and I’m able to cast the lines more equally. When I really pay attention to keeping a tight loop either line does well. I like the thin, non-stretchy feel of the Airflo. The few times the wind did kick up it tended to affect the Airflo more than the Rio though. 

 

I didn’t catch any stripers, but I did catch a pretty big shad on the Airflo line, which was a blast. 

I got a nice shad in Seabrook today too (and a striper). The shad fought better than the striper, as they were about the same size. I always get them this time of year, I think they drop down from the 'Mac, but unlike in May they're eating and hitting striper flies.

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5 hours ago, 707steelnstripe said:

@crunch : in your estimable opinion, is it important that Dr. M. Evo know what cause his tailing loops? 

Yeah, spend your day fishing worrying about your tailing loops instead the things that actually catch you fish - where, when, moon, tide, fly and presentation. 

 

It’s fishing not a figure skating competition.  There are no judges scoring on your outfit or casting style.

 

In terms of your cast, getting your fly to the fish’s face is ONLY thing that matters.

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46 mins ago, Cpalms said:

Yeah, spend your day fishing worrying about your tailing loops instead the things that actually catch you fish - where, when, moon, tide, fly and presentation. 

 

It’s fishing not a figure skating competition.  There are no judges scoring on your outfit or casting style.

 

In terms of your cast, getting your fly to the fish’s face is ONLY thing that matters.

The problem with tailing loops, mine, at least, is that they tend to create knots in leaders and tippets.  This could cause the obvious problem if the fly ends up in the face of a decent-sized fish.   For me, there are two options: worry about tailing loops or constantly be checking my leader for knots and dealing with them when I find them.

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3 hours ago, Cpalms said:

Yeah, spend your day fishing worrying about your tailing loops instead the things that actually catch you fish - where, when, moon, tide, fly and presentation. 

 

It’s fishing not a figure skating competition.  There are no judges scoring on your outfit or casting style.

 

In terms of your cast, getting your fly to the fish’s face is ONLY thing that matters.

 

CPalms I'd to get you out OTW and show you about tailing loops. It's not brain surgery--Dr. EVO, take note--it's just a few simple concepts that can help us all deal with adversity commonly encountered in trying to solve the basic problem CPalm you yourself laid out so articulately: getting fly to fish face, fish face!

 

 

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7 hours ago, drmevo said:

I fished both lines today on a late lunch break. Minimal wind, pretty ideal conditions. I had some good moments and some not so good moments, but overall things are getting better and I’m able to cast the lines more equally. When I really pay attention to keeping a tight loop either line does well. I like the thin, non-stretchy feel of the Airflo. The few times the wind did kick up it tended to affect the Airflo more than the Rio though. 

 

I didn’t catch any stripers, but I did catch a pretty big shad on the Airflo line, which was a blast. 

 

Doesn't RIO have low-stretch core? Airflo has this and it's great. Like electric wire to fish. Feel all it's struggles. 

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9 hours ago, 707steelnstripe said:

@crunch : in your estimable opinion, is it important that Dr. M. Evo know what cause his tailing loops? Or, do you agree with CPalms, that he just needs a shooting head style line??? 

 

Or do u agree with Mike Oliver that this thread has run its course and Doc Evo doesn't need anymore of our help because "Oly" is "fatigued" "bored" and "sleepy". 

I think avoiding the Tailing Loop is essential skill!!! TL can come with any style line. Always when I read "load" I first suspect TL problem. Still many believe that rod "load" is essential which then "slings" the line to distance.

 

I think it is also essential to learn Drifting too! Because I Drift I can cast heavier line than Mike!

 

I also believe that overhead casting practice is best when done on practice session preferably on lawn.

 

Esa

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Cpalms said:

Yeah, spend your day fishing worrying about your tailing loops instead the things that actually catch you fish - where, when, moon, tide, fly and presentation. 

 

It’s fishing not a figure skating competition.  There are no judges scoring on your outfit or casting style.

 

In terms of your cast, getting your fly to the fish’s face is ONLY thing that matters.

Why do you fly fish if you don't wan't to benefit using fly LINE casting? If catching, especially salt water fish, using weighted lures is often more productive and definitely easier!

 

Esa

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Esa I do drift honest. LOL.

 

ok lawn casting. Good for learning OH cast in terms of technique. Setting up cast for decent loops etc etc. I need to do some as currently struggling getting straight line path and decent loops especially on forward cast. It’s driving me nuts.

 

Line matching kind of if you have some decent wind.Otherwise you can kid yourself.. I bet that for many lawn casting leads to over lining too far.

 

You are obviously not wading and you have no waves to contend with.

Or steep beach incline or those ropes put out there to protect the Plovers.

Dog walkers and shell hunters. 

 

Reality is the beach or jetty or boulder field or sand bar. It can be very stark reality compared to that  nice cut lawn.

 

Flies attached to leaders in stead of fluff make a difference to.

 

The heavier line thing can be taken too far and you know when it’s too far when casting into a head wind.

 

 

Mike

 

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