Mike Oliver

Sorry done before need TH line 550 grains

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Those John Norris lines are OK but quality control is not so good. Line weights vary a lot and I ended up getting the bloke in the shop to weigh the heads before replacing the ones I sent back. Not a very long front taper and short back taper, running line is thin but shoots well. I paid £12 or less for mine.

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Mike those running lines will probably work great. I use running lines cut from a WF13I line and they've been wonderful. 

 

I haven't done so yet but I'm pretty sure your rods will spey cast well with heavy enough lines. Based on what I know your MkI should spey cast 840 grains with ease and be very smooth with it. I'm going to try 950 this Wednesday. Will let you know how it works in an email. Finished my 14' MkI last Saturday night. I'll send pictures of that and the MkIII later today. 

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Esa

 

Sounds interesting. John Norris has always sold low cost no brand lines. Some were way off weight wise. Wonder who makes them.

 

Ok if by trimming off some of the front or maybe having to cut all of it off to get length of 33 to 35 feet that might be bit clunky but at least no loop where it is the biggest pain between running line and head section.

 

Floaters he will have how about Intermediates and fast sink Esa.

 

mike

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Posted (edited) · Report post

45 mins ago, Mike Oliver said:

Killie

 

They certainly cast very well.I have got two of them. A 550 head and I think the other is a 720 head. I got them purely to try and find lines of around these weights. I only ever cast one of them into water once so don’t have a clue how they behave once in the water. Hope to put that right in May.

Since casting a real Spey rod and being shown the ropes by a qualified instructor I am in serious danger of getting hooked . Be even better if we had affordable quality river fishing in the UK to justify the investment.

What  tickled me is that when presented with a rod I never even enquired as to its length. I just tried to cast it as directed. Later I found out it was a 14 footer.

Compare this to surf TH fly rods where there is a huge reluctance and fear to go beyond 11 feet. Hard for me to figure this. How many river guys insist on 11 footers.

 

I think the running line to the iflights is an Intermediate. I purchased it at the same time or Oakman may have given it to me. Will try and find out who made it.

 

What about the running line taken from an Airflo Cold Water Ridge Intermediate. That’s an I Line and handles pretty well. I suspect it is weldable to.

 

mike

 

You must have gotten a blended/welded line because the iFlights are all heads. 

 

I have nothing against longer rods, although what I use the most are 11' to 11'9".  I also have rods that are 12', 12'6" and 12'9". 

 

On the West Coast we have gotten into throwing shorter lines with heavy tips especially for fishing in tight quarters, as that is the case on many of our smaller coastal rivers and even a few mid sized rivers. The newer short heads match up really well with short spey rods.  It's a valid regional difference but there are still debates.

 

Shorter TH rods pack down better for air travel.   I am testing my 11' 5 piece rod this spring and summer.  It has a spin/fly handle.  It fits in luggage.  I prefer to travel with both a TH rod and also a single hand rod.   My preference is that both the single hand and TH rod take the same lines.   All of this results in (and from) a preference for shorter heads - ~28' to ~37.5'.  The lines also weigh in mainly at around 425-550g because that's all that has been available in integrated lines on the market (still true - see Graveyard's table above) and like many I had learned to live with it, although that may change (see below).  A final advantage is that I can find all kinds of lines in that weight range from tropical to temperate, and from floating to sinking.  I can use the same reel on both the TH and single hand rods, using multiple spools. 

 

So, now for the first time I am trying to match up a powerful TH rod (still what you would call short - see preferences and why) with a line that is 630 to 675g.  Not available.  Have to put a franken-line together.  The line's head will be ~32'.  Or maybe 33'.  The rod was tested with lines weighing as low as 450g and as high as 700g.  32-33' and 630 to 650g was the sweet spot. 

Edited by Killiefish

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Killie

 

My bad sentence construction. My iflight  is only a head. I looped on an I Line running line. I will try and find out which brand it is.

 

Too many lines and can’t keep track of them

 

Got to envy the guy with one rod on reel and one line. Happy as Larry.

 

Fully get shorter Spey rods for tight small rivers.

 

Interesting rod line project you are engaged with.

 

Air travel is starting to have yet again a huge influence on rod design. First it was 4 piece and with TH rods it is going the way of six pieces.

 

It costs me $200 to bring my rods to the USA and back when packed in a rod case. A six piece could fit main bag and save this cost.

But it means other gear can’t come due to weight.

 

It gets harder every year to fund these overseas trips.

 

mike

Edited by Mike Oliver

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10 hours ago, Mike Oliver said:

Hi Herb

 

Thanks that’s very kind. I can pick them up from you when we meet up,for a fish up north.

 

Afraid I have not gotten around to building that #9. It is so stiff. Bit scary. Fastest blank I have ever handled.

I really should build it. With  a line on it should be a bit tamer. 

When I have sorted out the probs going on I will make a start.

Be good to spend time with you in May. Looking forward to it.

 

Mike

...And if you wanted to sell one of those beach lines... I'd gladly help you out with that if you sent me a PM. I've been looking for one, have a CND Atlantis. 

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Lots of Airflo Skagit Compact Intermediate bellys 630gr, 660gr, 690gr and 720gr are available for $19,99 in ebay USA and it looks like "conus" postage is free. Also lots of floating Scientific Anglers Third Coast Skagit bellys around 400gr for $19,99 and few Skagit Switch WF 330gr lines for $29,99.

 

To but good behaving floating head I would take two SA Skagits and join their front tapers to make desired length and weight.

 

Joining two front tapers from two AF CS 630gr or 660gr should be good for stiff Carp rod users to have 700...800gr heads. For heavier heads using 690gr or 720gr keep head length in control...

 

Esa

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AFCS 630gr is 24ft and average weight comes dividing weight using length 630:24=26,25gr/ft. If you want to have 700gr head its length is 700:26,25=26,7ft. These examples do not have taper compensation and if front tapers are used 700gr head comes longer perhaps 28...29ft.

 

Using sections from two SA Freightliner which if 400gr/21ft=19gr/ft. For example 600gr head length comes when it is divided using average weight: 600gr/19gr/ft= about 31,6ft but perhaps in practice 33ft...34ft is closer because front tapers are lighter than average.

 

Floating AFCS 810gr costs now only $17 and that I have cast using stiff Carp rods but I have made it longer and smoother casting joining few feet thinner tapers to its both ends.

 

Building shooting heads and WF lines is quite easy and self made lines can be better than machines are able to manufacture! They are also cheaper unless you but lots of line building materials.

 

Obviously the "nozzle" where the line comes out of machine can be adjusted only up to max 1:2,5 ratio. It is fine for most fishing lines but for Spey lines that is not always big enough ratio.

 

Esa

 

Edited by crunch

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On 4/15/2019 at 3:55 PM, Mike Oliver said:

Killie

 

My bad sentence construction. My iflight  is only a head. I looped on an I Line running line. I will try and find out which brand it is.

 

Too many lines and can’t keep track of them

 

Got to envy the guy with one rod on reel and one line. Happy as Larry.

 

Fully get shorter Spey rods for tight small rivers.

 

Interesting rod line project you are engaged with.

 

Air travel is starting to have yet again a huge influence on rod design. First it was 4 piece and with TH rods it is going the way of six pieces.

 

It costs me $200 to bring my rods to the USA and back when packed in a rod case. A six piece could fit main bag and save this cost.

But it means other gear can’t come due to weight.

 

It gets harder every year to fund these overseas trips.

 

mike

Mike, have you considered shipping your 4 pc rods or 6 pc. rods +/gear to US for your fishing trips? Heavy duty shipping boxes here in the US at Home Depot cost $2+ and are 18" square, hold 60# max.,  and, believe me, they hold a lot! We ship two of these boxes to Florida each winter via FedEx. We put all our fishing gear in these boxes plus heavy weight clothing and anything else "heavy",  which we might need and which we wouldn't want to pack in our checked luggage. due to extra wt. cost.  Costs us $83 total for the two boxes, each way, from NY.  From UK, I don't know what the cost would be depending on your shipping choices,  but,  please consider, after checking costs,  just shipping as much of your gear to your Cape house plus packing your 4 pc. rods in your luggage, checked, and go from there? Just a suggestion:) It works for us. 

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Flysully

 

Thanks.I have looked into this. DHL one rod costs $75 each way. Then there is the problem of Customs  both ways and paperwork.

 

Easy  to ship from U.K. but how do I do if when in USA. Also not a known cost to ship back to U.K. Packaging needs to be very robust. Insurance companies will not pay out if goods shipped in cardboard.

When I send rods to USA I double tube them in plastic tubes.

 

Post office is not cheap in the USA.

 

Other problem is rental houses and getting timing right. You could be without gear for one full day.

 

Herb ships his gear but it’s internal USA like your gear.

 

In NY I have many $ worth of surf tackle  in storage in a friends garage. Not been back for 5 years. My best surf rods just sitting there not seeing the dark of night. It pains me..

 

Mike

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1 hour ago, Mike Oliver said:

Flysully

 

Thanks.I have looked into this. DHL one rod costs $75 each way. Then there is the problem of Customs  both ways and paperwork.

 

Easy  to ship from U.K. but how do I do if when in USA. Also not a known cost to ship back to U.K. Packaging needs to be very robust. Insurance companies will not pay out if goods shipped in cardboard.

When I send rods to USA I double tube them in plastic tubes.

 

Post office is not cheap in the USA.

 

Other problem is rental houses and getting timing right. You could be without gear for one full day.

 

Herb ships his gear but it’s internal USA like your gear.

 

In NY I have many $ worth of surf tackle  in storage in a friends garage. Not been back for 5 years. My best surf rods just sitting there not seeing the dark of night. It pains me..

 

Mike

Mike,

 

You can ship them to me at the shop.    I'll be meeting you at the Cape when you arrive and then you could always drop your package by the shop on the way to the airport on the way home (we're right off the road on your way to Boston),  and I can have our shipping manager package them to send home.   That part is easy.    The paperwork and cost maybe not so ?  We do ship internationally without much difficulty with Israel being the biggest pain due to their customs.

 

HT

 

 

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Thanks HT

 

Could not put you through that process.

 

US Customs could hold rod for days on end.

 

Uk Customs will charge me 4% then 20% vat and carrier will charge a handling fee on top of shipping fee when rod comes home.

 

If you don’t mind losing the will to live you can do paperwork that covers stuff that is to be returned. But it’s a nightmare.

 

I pays the $ 200 and bites the bullet.

 

mike

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Guys you should believe me now! So far the ebay prices are best but if there is common trend they will increase. I have never seen this appealing fly lines when new fishing season is beginning!!! After 2016 and 2017 season in UK ebay there was possible to buy heavy OH line material for powerful DH rods and I did because shipping to Finland was reasonable. I would buy many of these lines but shipping is quite expensive and nowadays I need to pay Tax as well.

 

You need to do research but for example:

 

Rio UniSpey Floating 10/11 Fly Line seems to be WF for ($22.95) so it possibly needs to be cut from tip to make it nice length and weight to OH cast? I bought just a head for about $30 few years ago. It is poor Spey line but for OH casting it is fine.

 

Rio Flight Skagit Head 750 Grain Floating for only $16,90 is very good. That is the head I did TH OH and Spey cast on my recent Frorida trip using 10ft DH rod and hooked few fish. It is discontinued Flight series which was not liked for Spey casting but for us SW fly fishermen it is long and tapered enough for blind casting where long length of stripped line is good and fish do not scare heavy splash when line lands.

 

SA Adapt Skagit Switch they are WF lines which need only tips. This in not cheap ($35) but for a WF line belly not expensive either. This come up to 440gr so you need to find its head length and you can calculate the tip length and weight. The SA is line manufacturer I have generally had best guality lines!!!

 

Also SA Third Coast Skagit Floating Heads $19.95 is lowest price I have ever seen...

 

Airflo Skagits I wrote earlier. They have been under $20 before but so far only after fishing season, never before.

 

It would be great if they are awailable this low prices all the time but I am afraid they wont!

 

Esa

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Perhaps better WF for TH OH than Rio UniSpey is Scientific Anglers Spey Evolution Spey Line 680 Grain although it costs more! You should find its head length and then estimate what length for example 550gr would come?

 

If Scientific Anglers Skagit Extreme Integrated Tip are WF lines they have potential being TH OH lines?

 

There are at least two different weight floating SA Scandi heads very cheap now. Scandi heads are versatile because they can be cast both ways. Normal way long front taper ahead when fly is smaller and delicate presentation is needed. When fly is big and when casting to strong head wind the thick end in front does it!

 

Esa

Edited by crunch

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