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strongest fly line loops

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Fly lines coating is the weak link not the braided IMO. I had some problems with the fly line finish coating material after I put the braided tube, looks the stress over the material along with dirt or who knows what kind of pollution is in the saltwater that cause  this part of the connection to crack and act like a hinge once the coat fade, I’m trying to finished tapered over that end where the braided  tube meet  the fly line.

This happens only once, but the entire 6” section of the  fly line  under the braided material it just slide off,  It happens in a 5 weight fly line.

 

With today’s fly lines I’m pealing ,shave or extend the core from the loop factory  line the 6” to 8” section, once I expose the core and see what the material core is, Ill go with the different options before mentioned, first I slide the braided loop tube over the core exposed section and do few double overhand stopper knots over the core, slide the tube back over the knots to the finish position and do a simple nail knot with 15lbs test mono or 40 lbs test  braided fishing line to finish it next  to each of the bump I created by the double overhead stopper knot, UV light flex over the end “hinge” point would help to prolong the life on the fly line coat in that spot. Cleaning the gear  every outing it’s.also increasing the life of the full system. 

This double overhand stopper knot and braided tubes is done on comercial fishing. I couldn’t find any better description I’m sorry. 

Hope it helps I’m not used to do this long  Sundays posting especially  before going to Church. 

best 

Viete

 

 

 

983A1045-7AD2-439D-B123-386109C0DDA6.jpeg

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21 hours ago, bonefishdick said:

I never had an issue with factory loops on a fly lines. I believe when they first started adding welded loops there were some issues but they stepped up the loops and I have not heard off any issues in a long.

 

I will agree that sometimes we have to replace a factory loop or add one to to a new line that did not have one.

 

It is not that hard to add a loop, I just use a nail knot tool and 10 lb mono and cover the knots with flex cement, this one is 5 years old and still looks like new.

 

P1050250.JPG.62fe6500de7be0540c030c953c69d35a.JPG

 

 

i have used a similar method before. I'm looking for some other options too. Thanks for sharing

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5 hours ago, Vieteiro said:

Fly lines coating is the weak link not the braided IMO. I had some problems with the fly line finish coating material after I put the braided tube, looks the stress over the material along with dirt or who knows what kind of pollution is in the saltwater that cause  this part of the connection to crack and act like a hinge once the coat fade, I’m trying to finished tapered over that end where the braided  tube meet  the fly line.

This happens only once, but the entire 6” section of the  fly line  under the braided material it just slide off,  It happens in a 5 weight fly line.

 

With today’s fly lines I’m pealing ,shave or extend the core from the loop factory  line the 6” to 8” section, once I expose the core and see what the material core is, Ill go with the different options before mentioned, first I slide the braided loop tube over the core exposed section and do few double overhand stopper knots over the core, slide the tube back over the knots to the finish position and do a simple nail knot with 15lbs test mono or 40 lbs test  braided fishing line to finish it next  to each of the bump I created by the double overhead stopper knot, UV light flex over the end “hinge” point would help to prolong the life on the fly line coat in that spot. Cleaning the gear  every outing it’s.also increasing the life of the full system. 

This double overhand stopper knot and braided tubes is done on comercial fishing. I couldn’t find any better description I’m sorry. 

Hope it helps I’m not used to do this long  Sundays posting especially  before going to Church. 

best 

Viete

 

 

 

983A1045-7AD2-439D-B123-386109C0DDA6.jpeg

Good info, thanks for sharing

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BFD said, "I never had an issue with factory loops on a fly lines. I believe when they first started adding welded loops there were some issues but they stepped up the loops and I have not heard off any issues in a long."

  I was very disappointed, when the Orvis factory installed loop (not sure if "welded, @ that time,  or just "installed as a braided mono loop"),  on the back reel end of my expensive Orvis floating line pulled out on a good fish at night on the Vineyard, leaving me with a lost fish plus an expensive flyline.

  When I went back to my Orvis shop to purchase a replacement floating flyline, which I really like due to their great castability, the Orvis employee in the flyfishing department didn't even blink an eye when I told him the Orvis installed back end loop had failed, I had lost a good fish plus an expensive flyline, like, $65/$70?.   Can you imagine? My backing loop was intact, as I showed him,  yet, the flyline was gone! 

  No offer to replace, free of charge. However, because I do like their floating flylines, I purchased another at full price but, lucky for me, I had a coupon to make the price a bit more palatable.   Not great nor attentive customer service, I will say. Just a clerk, doing his job for his day's pay.

   I'll also say that I cut off the factory installed reel end loop on my new Orvis line and installed my own braided loop using Gudebrod braided mono which has never failed me yet on this line or any other flyline I've put a Gudebrod braided mono loop on. 

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22 hours ago, bonefishdick said:

I never had an issue with factory loops on a fly lines. I believe when they first started adding welded loops there were some issues but they stepped up the loops and I have not heard off any issues in a long.

 

I will agree that sometimes we have to replace a factory loop or add one to to a new line that did not have one.

 

It is not that hard to add a loop, I just use a nail knot tool and 10 lb mono and cover the knots with flex cement, this one is 5 years old and still looks like new.

 

P1050250.JPG.62fe6500de7be0540c030c953c69d35a.JPG

 

 

And, yes, BFD, I like your use of braided mono loop attached with 10# mono, nail knotted, as I do, unless the flyline comes with loops at both ends. Seems the best way to do it. That is, until my Orvis floating flyline, loops on both ends, failed at the reel end of the line, and now, I've returned to cutting off those factory loops and installing my own braided mono loops!

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On 3/28/2019 at 0:19 PM, bhorsley said:

for all our billfish lines and rigs we make loops with 50 pound Dacron   never had an issue 

Brian, are you using Gudebrod 50# braided mono to make spliced loops or using the braided sleeve tubes, like Corsair/EZ Body looking stuff shown here and then inserting your folded flyline into the tubes and then securing with the 50# mono? You're the boss here as to how to secure loops to flylines, as we all admire so, looking forward to your clarification. Thanks.

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21 mins ago, flysully said:

Brian, are you using Gudebrod 50# braided mono to make spliced loops or using the braided sleeve tubes, like Corsair/EZ Body looking stuff shown here and then inserting your folded flyline into the tubes and then securing with the 50# mono? You're the boss here as to how to secure loops to flylines, as we all admire so, looking forward to your clarification. Thanks.

the only time I use braided loops is for bill fishing.  We join the backing to the back end of the fly line with one and the butt section to the head the line with them.  The idea is no knots every go through the guides.  The person who made some of my loops used Dacron then 50# braided mono over that.  Seemed over kill to me.  I use the loops that come on RIO's lines with no problems.  The Leviathan lines do not have loops so then I just fold the line over and tie a couple of nail knots with 15 pound braid.  

First photo is the Dacron Loop to the 80 pound butt section.  Second photo is butt section to fly line connection.  3 photo is knot on the Dacron loop to the fly line.   The Dacron loops are served with rigging floss.  This rig has caught at least 100 sailfish by us and my traveling crew

IMG_2113.jpg

IMG_2117.jpg

IMG_2119.jpg

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2 hours ago, bhorsley said:

the only time I use braided loops is for bill fishing.  We join the backing to the back end of the fly line with one and the butt section to the head the line with them.  The idea is no knots every go through the guides.  The person who made some of my loops used Dacron then 50# braided mono over that.  Seemed over kill to me.  I use the loops that come on RIO's lines with no problems.  The Leviathan lines do not have loops so then I just fold the line over and tie a couple of nail knots with 15 pound braid.  

First photo is the Dacron Loop to the 80 pound butt section.  Second photo is butt section to fly line connection.  3 photo is knot on the Dacron loop to the fly line.   The Dacron loops are served with rigging floss.  This rig has caught at least 100 sailfish by us and my traveling crew

IMG_2113.jpg

IMG_2117.jpg

IMG_2119.jpg

So do you loop to loop your leader to the fly line or do you fuse/splice the leader butt to the fly line with a dacron sleeve over them ?

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14 mins ago, sidelock said:

So do you loop to loop your leader to the fly line or do you fuse/splice the leader butt to the fly line with a dacron sleeve over them ?

We just loop to loop--the two Dacron loops.  never had an issue --After we get a legal release and the fish jogs off we put a ton of heat on the fish,had 14 or 15 pound of drag on a fish last week close to the boat and no problems.  We only fish 20 pound and have no worries not sure what would happen if you would use  30 to 50 pound leader 

the top photo is a picture of the butt section. It has a Dacron looks that is served on the 80 pound mono butt section the other of the butt section has a crimped loop and the double Bimini joins loop to loop 

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6 hours ago, flysully said:

BFD said, "I never had an issue with factory loops on a fly lines. I believe when they first started adding welded loops there were some issues but they stepped up the loops and I have not heard off any issues in a long."

  I was very disappointed, when the Orvis factory installed loop (not sure if "welded, @ that time,  or just "installed as a braided mono loop"),  on the back reel end of my expensive Orvis floating line pulled out on a good fish at night on the Vineyard, leaving me with a lost fish plus an expensive flyline.

  When I went back to my Orvis shop to purchase a replacement floating flyline, which I really like due to their great castability, the Orvis employee in the flyfishing department didn't even blink an eye when I told him the Orvis installed back end loop had failed, I had lost a good fish plus an expensive flyline, like, $65/$70?.   Can you imagine? My backing loop was intact, as I showed him,  yet, the flyline was gone! 

  No offer to replace, free of charge. However, because I do like their floating flylines, I purchased another at full price but, lucky for me, I had a coupon to make the price a bit more palatable.   Not great nor attentive customer service, I will say. Just a clerk, doing his job for his day's pay.

   I'll also say that I cut off the factory installed reel end loop on my new Orvis line and installed my own braided loop using Gudebrod braided mono which has never failed me yet on this line or any other flyline I've put a Gudebrod braided mono loop on. 

That really sucks! I’ve caught numerous large, hard fighting fish with welded loops and never had a prob, but you’ve got me thinking

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On 30/3/2019 at 11:45 PM, sidelock said:

This is the right way of making a double catch reverse none slip loop. Unfortunately its not in english but the illustration is very clear. The method shown in the other video posted leaves you with a simple splice loop that's not locked in and it produces a double walled sleeve over the fly line and that's very significant even in #35lb mono braid and especially with #50lb mono braid. The method illustrated in this video only has double wall thickness over the first 1/2" of fly line and you can also alternatively just butt the fly line to the inside tag end instead of of sleeving it over the fly line tip and just sleeve the running portion of the loop without compromising its strength of function.

I choose not to insert the fly line tip inside the short portion of the tag end, instead I just butt up to it for a more streamline finish.

 

Thanks Sidelock, I'll make an English version of the video in full hd quality as soon as I find the time.

Cheers

david

 

 

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 Big game fllyrodding  when you slide line inside loop I always install 2 nails knots over braid then zap a gap , never failed on anything ! 

 

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On 3/31/2019 at 4:52 PM, flysully said:

BFD said, "I never had an issue with factory loops on a fly lines. I believe when they first started adding welded loops there were some issues but they stepped up the loops and I have not heard off any issues in a long."

  I was very disappointed, when the Orvis factory installed loop (not sure if "welded, @ that time,  or just "installed as a braided mono loop"),  on the back reel end of my expensive Orvis floating line pulled out on a good fish at night on the Vineyard, leaving me with a lost fish plus an expensive flyline.

  When I went back to my Orvis shop to purchase a replacement floating flyline, which I really like due to their great castability, the Orvis employee in the flyfishing department didn't even blink an eye when I told him the Orvis installed back end loop had failed, I had lost a good fish plus an expensive flyline, like, $65/$70?.   Can you imagine? My backing loop was intact, as I showed him,  yet, the flyline was gone! 

  No offer to replace, free of charge. However, because I do like their floating flylines, I purchased another at full price but, lucky for me, I had a coupon to make the price a bit more palatable.   Not great nor attentive customer service, I will say. Just a clerk, doing his job for his day's pay.

   I'll also say that I cut off the factory installed reel end loop on my new Orvis line and installed my own braided loop using Gudebrod braided mono which has never failed me yet on this line or any other flyline I've put a Gudebrod braided mono loop on. 

I use both orvis lines and rio lines and I will admit that I have never had a welded loop fail but then again I can count on one hand how many times i've gotten into my backing so who knows.  I do usually just go with the loop if it's there especially on the front end because worst case I lose the leader and a fish.  On the back end though I try to make it bulletproof hence this post because I don't want my fly line gone.  Nothing worse than seeing $100 disappear into the water and potentially seeing your day end early.  I don't tend to carry a backup up reel/spool but still, your day is ruined at that point. 

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Posted (edited) · Report post

I put up a video about 10 years ago on youtube that can be found searching "video hollow mono  loop fly fishing appletarpon". It is a decent video I think on the technique of making the loop itself, but I've changed a few things. The extra catch I used to use is not needed.

 

I have since gone to using either dacron trolling braid or hollow "Toro Tamer" instead of hollow mono as BHorsley also does. I discovered that the mono does not hold up nearly as well as dacron or "Spectra" type line when tarpon run around channel markers, coral, oysters etc as do the others. Again, like Brian, I have gone to serving the connection rather than relying on one or two nail knots on the backing end. The reason is that the nail knot on that end may well be going through the guides at 30mph pulling against the drag - even faster for billfish. It can fetch up on one of them, and slide off, sounding like a .22 long rifle round and scaring the hell out of you - thinking your rod just exploded.

 

I now serve them with hollow gel spun, coat them with pliobond and cover with a couple coats of "Hard as Nails". There is never a problem with them going through the guides and the "Hard as Nails" remains very pliable and super slippery and can be re-done repeatedly.

 

On the leader end, I use a complicated process that not many people would bother with, using the finger squeeze technique and neither loops nor knots with a crimped loop to the fly.

 

The backing end is also a blind spliced loop, but the backing for the tarpon rods is 60# Toro Tamer up-spliced to 80# Jerry Brown for about 50 feet to the blind spliced loop. After the reverse pull-through, when making the loop, I insert a length of 80# inside just the loop section to serve as a cushion for the loop to loop handshake connection. It not only eliminates the cutting action of thin line but also makes the loops much easier to get apart.

 

Cheers,

Jim

 

Edited by wjc
added the backing end

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