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JohnP

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Hey let me stir the pot and ask a provocative question.  Hope I don't tick anybody off  hear me out

 

This forum is listed under How To

 

i see mostly treads showcasing photographs ...which I really enjoy

But

i don't see many threads discussing "how to" I.e. I don't see much appetite for discussion of "how I got that shot" 

i don't see a post with a professional grade shot with discussion over why some consider it agood shot from both an aesthetic and technical  perspective. There was mention of desire to respect intellectual property in the past

so while I love the photo themes and showing them, I'd like to hear more back n forth about how and why 

would that be a separate forum ?

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Hi John,

That's an interesting question! My guess is that most of visitors here are fishermen by nature and don't have time and appetite for deep diving in digital photography. Actually I know some here are really good at photography and they have contributed many tips and tricks in every aspect of this  game. 

SG

 

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I believe this question has been answered by our illustrious leader JimDE. That being said, there are a few threads that discuss pictures, etc.,

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Like it would be great to see a shot and hear debate about ISO or shutter speed or maybe discussion about what a certain lens might add 

 

For example I'm getting more interested in shooting at night and there's lots to experiment with

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44 minutes ago, JohnP said:

Like it would be great to see a shot and hear debate about ISO or shutter speed or maybe discussion about what a certain lens might add 

 

For example I'm getting more interested in shooting at night and there's lots to experiment with

John, The thing about photography is there are few hard and fast rules or red lines. Photography is a art form and that said it is all about the image one takes and what they may want it to be for those who view it. To have a discussion about say ISO or shutter speed used or even the lens and aperture used for a specific image would only have value for the one who shot the image and how they were using these variables to create what the photog wants the image to be to those who view it. For example a photog may want to isolate a subject in the scene.... there re many ways to do this like lighting or composition or lets say for this example he chose using a large aperture to have his subject in focus and items in from and behind out of focus. So there is a discussion about this image and the photog states he used F2.8 for the image and this shot is a midday bright sunlight shot....... shutter speed, and iso have to counter this 2.8 aperture to get a proper exposure. He could of used ND filters to darken the scene to allow a higher ISO or slower shutter speed. Or he has to use a very fast shutter speed and most likely a very slow ISO to obtain a neutral exposure because he elected using a 2.8 aperture to isolate his subject. Would the aperture, shutter speed, and ISO used in this case have much value to anyone other than the actual photographer especially when others may take a identical photo and use other methods to isolate a subject or maybe they want everything in focus? (this is why I leave the metadata on every shot I donate to the web) There are just no rights or wrongs in this as long as the photographer is happy with their results.

Now if he is unhappy and wants to know how he could of done the shot differently? Then we have a very large number of highly talented photographers on the forum that are more than happy to give their advice or things to try the next time out. Anyone having a specific question or is facing a specific challenge can ask for assistance and get some excellent distinctions to use to resolve their issues from some extraordinarily good photographers; some of which make or supplement their incomes using their photographic skills.

For another example your interest in "night photography"....... the variables are considerable like are you talking astrophotography or scenics, does your camera handle high ISO noise very well, do you have a tripod, what focal length lens and what is it's lowest aperture ( to use the 500 rule to avoid star trails.. or maybe you want to stack 100 star trail shots and create a star trailed sky scenic), etc... We can suggest a starting point but not knowing the specifics of your needs and wants the info would not be of much value to you or others unless they have nearly the same equipment wanting near exactly the same needs and wants in their night imaging. If you have a question about anything dealing with your photography and your enjoyment with your results I truly hope you will post a question and give the forum a shot at resolving them. It's a great group here and we are all in this forum to exchange our experiences with photography to make everyones experiences more enjoyable.

Anyone is more than welcome to ask specifics of any shot I post here and I will give them as much or as little info about the shot as they want.... but as I said we use the tools and techniques to specifically achieve the objective the photographer wants his image to portray to those who view it which most likely may not be what someone else may of wanted the image to portray........ 

Edited by Jim DE

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Got it

i noticed in one magazine a small section each issue called 

"how I got that shot" 

i understand and agree there are many ways to dial in to get a desired shot, but it almost feels like there could be discussion in favorite recipes

like with night..I get that shooting stars is different from shooting a street scene under lamplight 

I also respect that if photographers would rather not get into any tricks they've learned along the way, that must be respected

Edited by JohnP

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John I think you will find here on the photo forum there isn't much we don't share about our photography....... fact is most are very eager to share their tricks and tips if they are asked. I learned a long time ago I learn so much more by sharing what I know than keeping it close to the chest. I have yet to give a tip or trick and not learned something in the process.......... photography is a never ending source for learning and no one has all the answers .......

 

Edited by Jim DE

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Many fishermen who take photos casually with digital point and shoot cameras end up disappointed in their shots.  This is largely because: 

1. They are seduced by high "megapixel" ratings of modern cameras.  The typical point and shoot digital camera nowadays has too many photosites (pixels) crammed into too small a sensor.  That results in grainy images that lack depth, color and vibrancy.  Most people would be better off with a point and shoot that has 8 or fewer megapixels, and that can take a reasonable shot in low or diminishing light (like a sunset or sunrise image).  A 6-8 megapixel camera with a decent lens that is sharp in the corners is typically all you need for a decent on-line image or print at 5x7 or even 8x10.

2.  They don't read the manual of their camera to get the most out of it.

3.  They shoot in lighting conditions which have too great a range of tonal values.  So the shots look washed out in places, too dark in others.

4.  They don't understand the idea of photo composition or take shots with every subject dead center, resulting in no energy or sustained interest.  Our eyes want to be entertained and teased by possibilities and interesting compositions.

5.  They don't take a photo class and get their images professionally critiqued.  This is like not getting casting lessons.

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On your point #2 I've read my manual about 5 times and certain sections maybe 10 times

at this point I'm  best suited by going out and shooting under a range of settings, and then I going back to see what worked. A few of my best shots came under conditions that were counterintuitive. I never thought the picture would look good. 

Then my next areas will be higher shutter speed for sports and wildlife 

but like I said before it would be good to hear how others dialed in on a few of their favorite shots or discussed the work of others 

Edited by JohnP

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John, like the film days the final image is a product of 20-40% the capture and 60-80% post processing. In camera jpg engines only do just so much being proficient with a good post processing software imo is far more important than equipment used and the mechanics of the shot. It's like golf where people will practice on a driving range for hours and hours but spend much less time on their putting which is close to 50% of the number of strokes in a round of golf. I see this all the time where people chase equipment changes but barely use post processing softwares and this is quite the opposite of what was used to create those eye popping images we see and hope to create. When I am trying to capture a scenic as good as I possibly can get the initial capture I am on a tripod with a tethered laptop viewing what my sensor is seeing on a 17" screen afield. I may take 20 or more images of the same scene with various exposures and various focal points. At home the real work starts and the creativity in stacking or stitching or both and all the various lighting and color techniques I can apply in post processing. In the end the 20 or more images are used for the aspects I may or may not like in each and use what I like and discard what I don't to create the single image I wanted the photo to express to those that view it. There is no way a single captured image no matter what the settings that are used can create the same look or file size for large printing. My base scenic camera has a 42mp sensor. Most of my scenics are 200-500mp in file size (though I have had images that are well over a gig in file size) after all the post processing techniques are applied. Me telling someone my capture settings for a specific image that interests them would at best be a guess because that image may have 8 images with various settings for each of these shots to create a stacked and stitched final image.

No matter what a photographer did to capture a image that you have interest in unless you can recreate his post processing skills your final image will fall well short of your expectations. Yes a shot has to have a defined balance between Aperture, Shutter speed, and ISO to create a proper exposure but truth be known as long as I have the subject I want in my capture and it is in focus I can do all the rest in my post processing with the array of softwares I own. I can blur the back ground and foreground like a open aperture. I can expand the images dynamic range. I can add dimension and depth with shading and lightening. I can stack images, cut and paste, stitch images, obtain more or less focus, change composition with various techniques from cropping to blending to cut and pasting layers. The is literally nothing that cannot be done in this digital world if you have a in focus subject captured to work with and the more pixels one has in the image the more he can work with in post processing. I am not a fan of layered composite creations for images and rarely ever do that but I could create a pic taken of you and make you look like you are standing on the moon if I had a in focus image of you and you would have to view at a pixel level to actually see it was a cut and paste creation.

As a photographer I see images of others that draw my attention and I am interested in the distinctions I see that interest me whether it be his subject, the lighting, composition, etc...... what he used for settings for that specific shot for me is of no interest because I apply what I see in his image to my techniques and settings and try to get even more out of his distinction that initially drew my interest. 

 

John post a image and ask what others might of done differently to obtain a significant difference in the finished image or state what you don't like or what you really would of liked it to look like and see if you get some distinctions to try next time out or in post processing with that specific capture. This type feedback will give you a grocery list of things to try and play with till you find what works for you.

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8 minutes ago, Jim DE said:

John post a image and ask what others might of done differently to obtain a significant difference in the finished image or state what you don't like or what you really would of liked it to look like and see if you get some distinctions to try next time out or in post processing with that specific capture. This type feedback will give you a grocery list of things to try and play with till you find what works for you.

That's a good idea - also, make sure you include the camera metadata - which will tell the person reviewing the image what settings (ISO, aperture, fstop) as well as what camera model were used. 

Edited by Killiefish

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1 hour ago, JohnP said:

Sounds good. 

Ive done some post processing but not nearly as much as some

whats the favorite software ?

John,

I think the two most widely used software are Adobe Lightroom and Adobe Photoshop, the former is mainly a file management software but also has a set of remarkably rich file editing functions, the latter is mainly a photo editing software. I use both, with the Lightroom for the initial and basic file editing (such as, crop, contrast, exposure, white balance and noise adjustment, etc), and then use the Photoshop to do the final resizing, sharpening, etc.

I only do bird photography though. For photographers who do other type of photography (e.g. landscape) they might have other additional software and plug-ins to achieve their goals.

SG 

 

Edited by SurfGazer

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16 hours ago, Killiefish said:

on

;) John that like what is the favorite fly rod ;) 

 

the most used i would say by serious photogs is Adobe softwares specifically Lightroom or Creative Suite. The list of good to great softwares today seem endless. I have issue with Adobe customer service and marketing the software is great. I use Aperture which is a old unsupported Mac post process/DAM software as my primary PP software though I have near all of them. My next favorite is CaptureOne, I have CS and a deleted copy of LR6 but don't use either because it's Adobe. In total I own several dozen softwares and plugins that I use for their strengths. 

John like cameras you have to try them ( they all have 30 day trials) and pick the one that best fits your needs and wants with a user interface you can easily work with. 

Edited by Jim DE

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19 minutes ago, Jim DE said:

;) John that like what is the favorite fly rod ;) 

 

the most used i would say by serious photogs is Adobe softwares specifically Lightroom or Creative Suite. The list of good to great softwares today seem endless. I have issue with Adobe customer service and marketing the software is great. I use Aperture which is a old unsupported Mac post process/DAM software as my primary PP software though I have near all of them. My next favorite is CaptureOne, I have CS and a deleted copy of LR6 but don't use either because it's Adobe. In total I own several dozen softwares and plugins that I use for their strengths. 

John like cameras you have to try them ( they all have 30 day trials) and pick the one that best fits your needs and wants with a user interface you can easily work with. 

Might stick with adobe for now

the thing with flyrods actually is that many will do the job quite well but the marketing suggests you need specialized tools that should be frequently upgraded!

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