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Fiberglass in the Salt? Who is using and what?

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the ross cla reels have a rep for being reasonably priced workhorses.  a couple recently on ebay sold at less than $100.

re chinese glass, i have bought and built the blanks -- about a dozen of them, in trout weights from 6' to 7.5' in 3,4, and 5wts.  cosmetics and ferrule fit can be an issue with these blanks.  but they certainly can be made into good fishing rods... my guess is that it is likely the same for the bigger sw brethren although i have no first hand exprience with the bigger blanks.

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2 hours ago, tomkaz said:

Funny, I have an 11/12 Behemoth that I bought for a older 9" 12wt TFO that I picked up on the auction site for less than $100. I was going to pair that to the new 12wt I am waiting on just to get it on the water. Captain Scott Hamilton has had several Behemoths on his boat for a while and thinks highly of them, except for the finish. His daily usage has led to some compromise of the finish which he attributes to their not being anodized well (at all?). But as he says, for the price, they can't be beat. 

My desire is a Nautilus or a Hatch but not sure I can justify the cost for a rod that will be used less than a half dozen times a year. I missed buying a great condition Abel Big Game No. 4 last week which would have been a great "retro" reel (retro to the early 1990s that is) for half a new top-line reel. I actually want to get the new rod before committing to a reel to see what will balance it properly. 

why would the finish even matter....right?

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3 hours ago, capefish4231 said:

Tomkaz, I don't think the idea behind the "disposable"/cheapie level rods is to buy them ad infinitum as they break, but to buy one and if it works out well, then you're ahead. If it does not work, you took a chance and lost a little, but it would not be wise to repeat the same decision expecting a different outcome.

FYI there is an Abel No. 4 on the Boston CL right now in Metheun for $250.... includes a #8 line. If you want that I would jump all over it. Looks to be in great condition.

edit: sorry to say it is not the Big Game series however.

Don't get me wrong about "disposable", it is not an infinite loop. 

I looked at CraigsList and yes, that is actually a Big Game No 4 and a decent price. Only issue he wants cash, which suggests face-to-face, and I am about as far from Mass as one can get on the East Coast (almost). 

“No nation in history has survived once its borders were destroyed, once its citizenship was rendered no different from mere residence, and once its neighbors with impunity undermined its sovereignty.”

- Victor Davis Hanson 

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2 hours ago, slip n slide said:

why would the finish even matter....right?

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but the Behemoth does not appear to be anodized black or gray. It is either painted or powder coated, my guess the latter.

I fished with Scott's reels two weeks ago. The finish is pitted in a couple of spots on each reel with a bubbling effect spreading out from there. Must have been a thin spot in the finish that allow salt water to get underneath and it worked from there. All those intricate angles, only possible in a die cast process, can make for sharp edges or inside corners where the finish depth might be thinner than optimal. Does that impact performance? Heck no. 

My view on the 11/12 Behemoth is that the reel goes for $130 and extra spools are $50 IIRC. For the price of a Hatch or a Nautilus, you can buy a half dozen Behemoths and a couple of spare spools. If you were to "only" get two seasons from them (I think more in normal usage and maintenance), you could go a dozen years or more with a fresh reel every two years. Sure, not as "cool" or as purdy as those colorful anodized works of art but the fish don't care about the reel's color nor its construction method.

“No nation in history has survived once its borders were destroyed, once its citizenship was rendered no different from mere residence, and once its neighbors with impunity undermined its sovereignty.”

- Victor Davis Hanson 

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I've been chasing stripers with  Scott Heli-ply rods,  9 and 10 weight.  Just recently I aquired a Fenwick 9'3" Fiberglass Feralite rod rated for  AFTMA 10 line.  I put a weight  forward 12 weight line on it and it casts like a dream out to 70 feet.  It has a short detachable fighting butt.  I plan on using it on the bass.  It  has such a nice feel to it. I think the rod is over 50 years old and it appears new and unused. Can't wait to feel a striper on it.

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What rod would you use to try to hook a goliath grouper on a fly? I will find out tomorrow but I think it might resemble a long pool cue stick. 

“No nation in history has survived once its borders were destroyed, once its citizenship was rendered no different from mere residence, and once its neighbors with impunity undermined its sovereignty.”

- Victor Davis Hanson 

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1 hour ago, tomkaz said:

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but the Behemoth does not appear to be anodized black or gray. It is either painted or powder coated, my guess the latter.

I fished with Scott's reels two weeks ago. The finish is pitted in a couple of spots on each reel with a bubbling effect spreading out from there. Must have been a thin spot in the finish that allow salt water to get underneath and it worked from there. All those intricate angles, only possible in a die cast process, can make for sharp edges or inside corners where the finish depth might be thinner than optimal. Does that impact performance? Heck no. 

My view on the 11/12 Behemoth is that the reel goes for $130 and extra spools are $50 IIRC. For the price of a Hatch or a Nautilus, you can buy a half dozen Behemoths and a couple of spare spools. If you were to "only" get two seasons from them (I think more in normal usage and maintenance), you could go a dozen years or more with a fresh reel every two years. Sure, not as "cool" or as purdy as those colorful anodized works of art but the fish don't care about the reel's color nor its construction method.

My Behemoth is still going strong and showing no signs of corrosion.  Best reel for the $$.  I think it performs BETTER than a Hatch - it's way lighter, smoother deeper drag, looks better and about 1/5 the price.  The Behemoth will definitely not last as long but who cares at that price.  Hatch's are heavy old tech overgrown trout reels IMO.  So many better options, especially at the top of the price spectrum.

Edited by Cpalms
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Our club bought four Behemoths for teaching newbies with. One of them didn't even get a cast on it before it was broken: any slight ding from being dropped cannot be bent straight again without the metal snapping. The reel still works as a casting reel, but it has an 8mm section of the spool rim missing.

They are only powder coated, but assuming the user is not rough on their gear and washes them after use, they should last a long time. They have wonderful drags and they are indeed light. I'm too rough on my gear to consider buying one for myself.

FFi Certified Casting Instructor

 

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6 hours ago, Picketpin52 said:

the ross cla reels have a rep for being reasonably priced workhorses.  a couple recently on ebay sold at less than $100.

re chinese glass, i have bought and built the blanks -- about a dozen of them, in trout weights from 6' to 7.5' in 3,4, and 5wts.  cosmetics and ferrule fit can be an issue with these blanks.  but they certainly can be made into good fishing rods... my guess is that it is likely the same for the bigger sw brethren although i have no first hand exprience with the bigger blanks.

One thing I will say about the rod that I immediately was thrown off by was the spigot ferrules. Having never seen them before it took some research to learn that the rod sections are not necessarily supposed to butt right up against one another. There is about a 1/4" reveal between rod sections.

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So are you guys using them just for a different feel? Or do you find any advantages to it? Seems like they might give quite a bit of feel when fighting the fish. Not sure if I see any benefit to high sticking, even if you could do it without consequence; also not sure how a Fiberglass rod would eliminate the downfalls of high sticking with a graphite rod. 

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55 minutes ago, lisurfer49 said:

So are you guys using them just for a different feel? Or do you find any advantages to it? Seems like they might give quite a bit of feel when fighting the fish. Not sure if I see any benefit to high sticking, even if you could do it without consequence; also not sure how a Fiberglass rod would eliminate the downfalls of high sticking with a graphite rod. 

I can't answer for the other guys, but I started using it for the robust nature. 'Glass rods are impact-resistant (no clousering problems) and will bend to insane angles without snapping.

After I started using them for toughness, I discovered how much fun they are to fish with and to cast. They also taught me a lot about adapting my casting to the rod's characteristics (i.e. those of any rods).

I find no benefit to high-sticking in my situation, but it's often unavoidable on the kayak. That's when I break CF rods ... :(

Cheers,

Graeme

Edited by Hirdy

FFi Certified Casting Instructor

 

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1 hour ago, capefish4231 said:

One thing I will say about the rod that I immediately was thrown off by was the spigot ferrules. Having never seen them before it took some research to learn that the rod sections are not necessarily supposed to butt right up against one another. There is about a 1/4" reveal between rod sections.

spigot ferrules should never butt up against one another.  there should be a 1/4" to 3/8" gap.  

25 minutes ago, lisurfer49 said:

So are you guys using them just for a different feel? Or do you find any advantages to it? Seems like they might give quite a bit of feel when fighting the fish. Not sure if I see any benefit to high sticking, even if you could do it without consequence; also not sure how a Fiberglass rod would eliminate the downfalls of high sticking with a graphite rod. 

some advantages of glass are that it is tough as nails and can withstand a lot of abuse; because of its softer action it's better than graphite at protecting tippets; slower (than graphite) line speed of fiberglass makes for more delicate presentation, and if you're budget conscious, the cost of high end glass is a bargain compared to  graphite.  i prefer the relaxed casting stroke and the feel of a fish on glass. my 2 cents.  ymmv.

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My aim is the toughness and the ability to high stick without explosion. I don't want to high stick and understand how inefficient it is but sometimes it is hard to remember when you are trying to wind in an albie before Mr. Bullshark gets him. The ability of the rod to bend deep into the butt is also something of aesthetic value. Lastly, I wanted a shorter stick and there are not too many in 12wt in CF, though I do believe Loomis offers one. 

But put this another way. If my custom 12wt glass comes out to $500 all-in cost, that is still lower than the cost of comparable CF. And, it is more likely to be more forgiving to abuse. If I don't miss anything on castability, why not glass?

This is an experiment for me but there have been enough people who have done this and rave about it for me to think it has merit and fun-factor. 

“No nation in history has survived once its borders were destroyed, once its citizenship was rendered no different from mere residence, and once its neighbors with impunity undermined its sovereignty.”

- Victor Davis Hanson 

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I am not, but I will be using glass.

The thing with heavy CF rods is that their butt sections are really stiff. It creates strain on the casting arm. And also finding suitable lines that load them becomes difficult. For example my TFO BW MD can take a beating (I think there is also some glass in that for durability), but it is heavy, stiff and needs heavy lines. Not a pleasure to cast and I know it is not me or my casting.

The stiff butt gives the fish a lot of leverage even on high loads. The deeper the rod flexes, the shorter the lever and less force needed from the fisherman. I dead lifted a 4kg load (8.8lb) with 90 degree angle with my TFO BW MD and a diy glass rod. I have long handles on them both for fighting. I measured the force I had to use to hold the rod straight up. With TFO it was 16kg (35lb) and on the glass 10kg (22lb). And this was straight up and not from the direction of the hand (in an angle of course when fighting a fish so even more force is needed). So the ratio was 4 for the TFO and 2.5 for the glass (the smaller the better). This is something that is not needed in shore fishing as one can use low angles, but lifting tunoids on a boat - you need all you can get!

Here I am dead lifting on a 90 degree angle a weight of 6.9kg (15.2lb) with a rod that casts nicely #10 lines. Glass of course.

IMG_3770.JPG

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Collectively, you guys help me feel a little more informed every day - thank you! 

“No nation in history has survived once its borders were destroyed, once its citizenship was rendered no different from mere residence, and once its neighbors with impunity undermined its sovereignty.”

- Victor Davis Hanson 

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