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johnnygoat

Baitrunner vs spinning reel

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What is the difference between the baitrunner reel and a regular spinning reel. Are they good for the surf. Can you use them for live bait only or both. What are the advantages of the baitrunner over the spinning reel. How many of you guys are using and like them better then a regular spinning reel. Also I have a old penn reel 105c that I like alot which has a switch on it is this like a baitrunner reel.

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bait running reels have a secondary drag system.

 

When in baitrunner mode.  it allows the spools shaft to rotate under a secondary drag system usually locaded in the base of the reel.

 

Most re-engage the fight drag when the handle is turned.

 

Some spools have a quick drag feature that allows from baitrunner type settings to a fight drag pressue in 1 turn

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I use them, have 4 Okuma's and two Penns. They take the tension off the rod because the fish can swim which makes i easier to get that rod out the sand spike. Most will disengage with a turn of the handle and go back to the primary drag. And for some not using a decent sand spike could save you from having your rod launched! I used the for chunking bunker, clams etc. and not actually "Live Lining" 

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Thanks guy's that's what I was looking for. Penn calls them live lining and I was wondering if they where for live bait only. Sound like a nice option to use on the surf if you use multiple rods. Also I have a reel passed on by my father that I use all the time it's an old Penn 105c that has switch that allows the spool to free wheel not sure if it was made to use like a baitrunner but it also allows you to reel in line backwards.

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Baitrunners are great reels to wait and bait. I use them all the time for chunk fishing in the surf. Love that sound of the secondary drag scream when a nice fish takes the bait yet doesn't feel the tension of the primary drag. Click off the baitrunner switch which is preset to your liking and set the hook. Love um

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Thanks guy's that's what I was looking for. Penn calls them live lining and I was wondering if they where for live bait only. Sound like a nice option to use on the surf if you use multiple rods. Also I have a reel passed on by my father that I use all the time it's an old Penn 105c that has switch that allows the spool to free wheel not sure if it was made to use like a baitrunner but it also allows you to reel in line backwards.

 

Johnny:

 

The switch you are referring to is the anti-reverse dog switch - your dad's reel dates back to the era before one-way roller bearings.  By the way most JDM and EDM long cast spinners still use this design.  If you look at the Shimano USA site under surf reels and the Daiwa USA site under European Carp equipment you will see the same feature.  Although there is a Shimano "Big Baitrunner LC" and a Shimano "Medium Baitrunner LC" on the EDM, a lot of the Baitrunner featuring LC spinners incorporate the feature into the spool itself.

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Lots of guys including myself like to use a baitrunner reel for snagging bunker. After snagging a bunker you flip the reel into baitrunning mode which allows the bunker to swim ( almost ) freely with the school.

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I think Salmon guys use the feature to allow the the fish to take the bait. Basically hand feeding the bait...I have never personally used the feature but I'm sure someone can clarify.

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I have a couple Shimano, that I only use for bait fishing and the second drag system is great and even can be used in the canal with a strong current by simply turning up the bait running drag at the back of the reel.. I actually like the 2500 size..

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Going back to the Luxor/Crack and Ru-Mer fishing reels, these were originally designed (in 1948, I believe) as Salmon Fishing reels in Europe, as in Atlantic Salmon, that actually used to grow really big before, much like Atlantic Cod, the large breeder genetic lineage was decimated by overfishing. Anyway, Salmon, when they go to fresh water for spawning, exhibit a predatory genetic lineage protection behavior that displays itself with consumption of egg sacks that drift past as they fin into the current. The Salmon are not actually feeding for nourishment, but rather seeking to eliminate eggs fertilized by other males.

 

Now you know why Salmon Fly Fishers work so hard to develop their "greased line swing" and line mending skills, so as to affect a drag-less, neutral buoyancy drift of the fly to the fining fish.

 

Accordingly, the preferred method, with Spin fishing, to achieve a drag-less drift was to keep the Anti-reverse Dog off, and to feed the egg sack imitation downstream by slowly winding the reel backwards while keeping just enough tension in the line to both prevent line loops off the reel and be able to feel the Salmon inhale the imitation. Then, upon pick-up, the fisher-person would engage the anti-reverse with their thumb, bringing the drag into play. It is noteworthy that the anti-reverse dog lever was located just behind the handle shaft housing of the side plate. An interesting development by Luxor was to come out with the Crack 300, which changed the drag into an instant drag (i.e., 3/4 turn to full engagement), presumably to more easily enable the 3 step process of going from "back-winding" the reel to full drag for reeling in the fish against the rather strong current of the larger European rivers, such as the Rhine. Of note is that back then the only drag disc material was oiled leather, so the quick drag was facilitated by a shoulder on the back of the spool that brought the Aluminum material (of the shoulder) in contact with the Marine Bronze of the drag clicker toothed disc on the reel shaft.

 

Later on, circa 1950, the Luxor and Crack design was refined for Surf Fishing, with a notable addition of a brake ring on the handle shaft housing that, with the turning of a threaded and knurled ring, would apply locking pressure to a shoulder on the re-designed handle assembly. This would then prevent the handle from turning during the cast (of a heavy surf bait payload), which would have caused the bail to accidentally close. Unfortunately, again due to lack of sophisticated composite materials in that time period, most users found that the handle brake did not work very well, which is why most Luxor and Crack 300 series still around today have in their lifetime been converted to manual bail by cutting off the bail wire. Luxor 300s of this era were labeled as follows SAUMON-LUXOR-MER.

 

Incidentally, the 1952 end of production of the Luxor and Crack reels was due to an intellectual property dispute between Luxor Corp and the designer, P. Mauborgne, not unlike the one that more recently brought an end to the production of All-Star Blanks.

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Baitrunners are very popular with carp fisherman . Shimano has many models that are only sold in the European market. Rods are placed in bank sticks or pods. Carp hook themselves and run off in the baitrunner mode. The rod is picked up and the main drag is engaged with the turn of the handle.

I love baitrunners for carp and cat fishing . I've never used the baitrunner feature in the surf. Even at it's heaviest setting, it tends to slip and play out slowly if there is any surf or current at all.

Still great tools for calm conditions . The baitrunner drag makes riigging up easier too, more control than just flipping open the bail.

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I'm not a big fan of baitrunners for the most part. They put out more drag than people realize even when turned all the way down to the lightest setting. The respectable fish can feel it and it spooks them. Now for other species that aren't all that line shy, it can work. I have see bluefish drop the bait before though. I used to use them all the time. I ended up selling them all expect for a pair. I got sick of hearing that zip and then realizing the fish dropped the bait. They can be useful for when you just want to hangout in a chair doing wait and bait. I usually just do the rubberband trick though . In a general sense, you can use a baitrunner reel just like any other reel. However, it does not come without it's compromises. One is that they are the biggest pain to maintain. The baitrunner D is my least favorite reel to work on. The B isn't too bad but it just takes too long.... The other thing is cost. It's just an average reel with a complicated secondary drag system. Third, is weight. Unless you are using that feature all the time why carry it around. It's not a huge deal but if you are mainly throwing lures why use a baitrunner?

 

If you do go with a baitrunner, I'd try and pick up an old B series Shimano. I don't like the mechanism on the Penns. Both the slammer and the SSV have it located right under the sideplate. It's a more precarious design in my opinion.

 

For live bait fishing on my boat, I like a conventional reel. Just thumb the bait and let her swim. You can manually control the tension. 

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I do bait and wait with 5 or 6 rods. Thought the Shimano Baitrunner would be the way forward. It wasn't.

 

After casting, I spike the rod and while there adjust the drag. Flipping a lever is no easier because I was checking that drag, too.

 

I would look for a reel that had another feature that would help out.

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