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karman13

First time surf fishing, couple of questions about leaders, and knots.

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Hi I hope that I am in the right place for my questions since this is my first time in the forum. I am going to go surf fishing for the first time to Chacahua, Oaxaca in Mexico, and I have seen fisherman fishing from the beach, and from a big rock structure and they fished some big fish like different species mackerel, snook, red snappers, and even mahi mahi, and tuna sometimes over 50lb, they always use lures over there. I bought the Penn fierce 8000 combo with the 10ft rod, I also bought 80lb Power Pro line. 

 

My questions are:

 

Since I am fishing with braid for the first time which leader material, and strength is more recomended for fishing from a rock structure, and the beach?(the sea floor is just sand, no rocks) Should I use wire leader? Should I use a swivel to attach the leader to the main line or just a uni to uni knot?

 

I am planning on using lures most of the time, so I really want to avoid loosing them because of a bad set up, or a toothy mackerel.

 

Also I am having several issues with cinching the last loop on the double palomar with the 80lb Power Pro, the last loop wont cinch because the other knot is already too tight, because when I pull my line it just tightens the first knot, and not the loop itself. What can I do? or should I just avoid this and use the Double Uni knot.

 

 

Thank you! 

 

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Mono should be fine for leader.  For the kind of fishing we do in the striper coast, the standard set up is braid to swivel (usually Spro brand) to mono (2 to 3 feet)  to Tactical Anglers Clip.  I used 30 lb braid and 50 lb mono. I like the little 80 lb. swivels.  The knots are all uni knots with the braid going through the eye of the swivel 3 times and 8 to 10 loops.  Wetting the mono is very important before cinching the knot.  I personally do not like the Palomar knot. I find it hard to tie properly on heavy mono. 

 

Cheers!

Edited by leopinetree

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braid should be tied to a swivel with a palomar knot.  Double the line, pass it through the swivel, tie an overhand knot, then loop the open end around the swivel.  

Pull the double line to tighten, slowly working it so that it tightens evenly, and when you get close to tightening the knot stick that swivel and knot in your mouth and soak it up good with your spit.

Then pull it tight.

 

If you DO NOT use a swivel then the standard is the alberto knot which is a modified albright to join the braid to leader.  I use a modified albright that TimS (the guy running this place) had written about on some post a long while back.  It's simply the albright, but use 20 to 25 wraps and then when passing the tag back through the loop, do that twice doubling the lock.  I finish with a 'lock knot' which really just allows you to keep a nice long tag end neatly tied at the back end of the knot.  All the albright type knots will continue to tighten down under load so for insurance, I like that lock knot just in case I was unable to pull the knot tight enough myself.  Use a glove on the braid, it will cut you when trying to tighten down.  These knots take a little practice, but once you get it they are really easy to tie.

 

Your 80# line will probably be impossible to break before breaking your reel or rod.  I think you wouldn't need to go any higher in strength than that for your leader either.  The choice to use wire (steel or other metal) usually depends on whether you are targeting toothy critters.  Up here in the northeast of the US most of us are targeting striped bass.  Our problem is that bluefish which have sharp teeth and strong jaws often intermix.  We usually opt to fish with mono or fluoro leaders as the lure action is much better and reduces visibility of the line.  It can cost you a plug here and there and it's a risk you have to be willing to take.  So the choice to use wire depends on what you are doing and whether the fish will care.

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Thanks for the suggestions, and quick response, they're all handy. I didn't knew about the Tactical anglers clip, I think I'll have to order some online. They look amazing!

Also the modified albright seems perfect. Although I am seriously thinking about the wire leaders, 1 or 2 feet maybe, there are some toothy creatures out there.

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 Although I am seriously thinking about the wire leaders, 1 or 2 feet maybe, there are some toothy creatures out there.

Don't bother, you wont need them. The only bite-off''s I've had (and I can on one had minus a few fingers) have been when I was pencil popping during a bluefish blitz. They bit the barrel swivel that connects to the braid, so wire wouldn't helped anyway.

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Ok so I'll give it a try with a mono leader of abot 3-4 feet with a swivel.

The leader should match the 80lb test of my main line? Or what breaking strength is recommended?

Thanks again!

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I'll take a look at them...Also we don't have Tactical Angler clips or Breakaway clips here on Mexico so I'll do my best I found the Matzuo or Blue Fox clips , and swivels. Any experience with them?  if I want Spro or the recommended clips I'll have to order them from the U.S...which is really expensive right now because of the dolar-peso relationship (Its almost 17 pesos per dollar) which is insane, I am used to 12 to 1

I am going to buy some fluorocarbon leader I'll try to find 80lb if not I'll go with the 60lbs, and take the wire leaders just in case there are any sierras around (Pacific sierras are like our Bluefish they break the lines, and attack all the shiny stuff including swivels, with the difference that they taste grate).

Also do you think that the fluoro leader works for the Cubera Snapper? or should I use the wire for them, there are some big ones out there.

Thanks for all the suggestions I'll make a post of my fishing trip to Oaxaca on September.

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Hi, Karman13,

 

I Spent a year working at G Bay Cuba and did a lot of fishing while I was there.  We mostly rented boats and trolled live bait or deep divers.  Because of the amount of barracuda, king mackerel and other toothy fish in the bay, we always used wire.  Not saying that you have to, but may be wise to pick up a package of 40 - 60# test Nalin wire and the the small hexagon tool used to fashion the leaders quicker.  Might be best to pre-make some prior to going, just Yotube it  With some of those fish you only get one use out of a leader no matter which material you use.  

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Thanks for the answer, yeah I'll take some 60 wire leaders some black, and some bleeding leaders just in case.

I'll speak to the local fisherman to see if I'll go for 60-80 fluoro or the wire.

Also I just found that Amazon Mexico sells Spro so I'll get some 120 swivels, and for the snaps, I'll try the Spro Split Snaps lets see how they behave, Any experience with them? I am unable to buy tactical anglers or breakaway clips.

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Ok, I had to order the 80lb Sufix Invisiline...I couldn't find the seaguar or Yo-zuri in Mexico.


I've never used fluoro before, what kind of knot would you recommend for the 80lb its really stiff, and has tons of memory.


So far only the Fish n Fool (double uni) or the Centauri had worked for me (the second one is harder to cinch) any suggestions on which knots to use?


 


Thank you


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Oh yeah! that is the centauri knot that I mentioned, but thanks! The thing is that I have always used knots that go through the eye of the swivel two times, I just don't feel confident enough with one pass. 

This Centauri (the one from the video) and the Uni (with a double loop or fish n fool) are the only knots that I have been able to cinch down tightly on the 80lb fluoro the centauri is specially hard to cinch tightly on the fluoro, but it'll cinch eventually.

The Palomar is just not an option, I am able to cinch it down properly on the braid now, but in the fluoro different story, It's just to hard to cinch, and tighten. There is no way that I use the palomar on 80lb fluoro.

Edited by karman13

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