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surfacetension

Rudders?????????????

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Fished Sandy hook yesterday in a 15 to 20 mph cross wind and could have really used a rudder , I am thinking of putting one on But have some questions about loading and unloading and when you put it on the ground does the rudder flip up like in a Hobie cat??? also does anyone fish with one ????

 

Yesterday at the hook the boats were about 1 mile out too rough for even the tog boats but they did limit out on striped ones

 

thought it would be the perfect day to be out / ??????????I guess I have to get some better weather reports the wind was howling from the dead east

 

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Surf,

yeah they do kick up like a Hobie, but will not stay up like a hobie. Meaning don't accidently go backwards or sideways. I have one on my America and love it. I just pull it up when going shallow. With a cam cleat, you put the rudder straight out the back, like a Hobie and that would give some steerage in shallows, but just as easy to pole off the bottom. ScottO

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Rudders do help on badly designed kayaks. They also make up for lack of paddling skills. I used one on a dolphin the second year I yaked. The drag it created made me work harder than when I was fighting the wind. I realized after a couple more years that once I realy learned the delicate art of paddling that I didnt need a rudder no matter how hard or what direction the wind came from. Try just going paddling sometime without any fishing gear. Learn and master the J-stroke that is what You will use to stay on course in side wind.

Barrell

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Hey Barrell,

 

I beg to differ on the design issue, I'm not sure what a poorly designed yak is? Maybe the application of the yak should more dictate the design of the boat. As for the rudder I think there are lot's of good times to use a rudder. Like mindless paddling, just looking at the sky and paddling willy nilly, the rudder does a great job of tracking. I think there is some advantage when fighting a fish, I believe that the ability to over power the fish faster with the rudder reduces the fight to the advantage the fishes survivability after release. I think overall a rudder is an individual decision and that there are some real advantages. When I'm fishing I'm fishing, not worrying about j-strokes and the zen of paddling. Let me put my head down, paddle like mad and chase the birds.

 

My 2 cents, 1.4 cents Canadian

 

PS, what makes a good design track well can be a real PIA in tight places. Alot of the fishing platforms are beamier and lose a bit to tracking. A rudder can help. S

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Barrell, I agree with you in the purist-paddler sense, but I still like the rudders on my sit-in boats when fishing. Helps set the boat at a better angle to the fish for more pressure, for one thing, when fighting a fish. Helps guide me during drifting and casting, for another. And, of course, if I want to paddle without the rudder, I can just pull it up from the cockpit and leave it up. Or down, as I like at the time.

 

 

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BTW, 2 cents US is 3.1 cents Canadian. It seems like rudders (and flip up skegs) are like cleats on a boat, line grabbers. In the down position, they are sort of like and outboard, a line grabber. biggrin.gif

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If you don't need the steering capability, just the tracking assistance, it might be a lot easier to install a rudder as a skeg. You would need to lock the rudder in the straight ahead position but you cold skip the pedals and controls and just have the line on a cam cleat to raise and lower the blade. Just a thought. Would obviously depend on what kayak and how it's set up already.

Jim

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RJ,

you know I thought about that and I did go the wrong way. hmmm if I can give 1.4 cents american that should come close to two cents canadian...

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Surface, If You have a Tourer You need a rudder that is one of the boats I was talking about. Without the rudder it drives me crazy in wind especialy straight into the wind. I agree that a rudder comes in handy for controlling angle of the boat during drifts but that was not what the original question was about. The j-stroke is not some purist thingy. It is as basic as butter on toast and needs to be mastered by anyone who owns a yak. It is basically a good forward stroke which is then screwed up on purpose at the end with a j-hook. Many guys who have trouble going straight are actualy j-stroking without realizing it.

Barrell

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Hey Barrell, I've been yaking for a couple of years and canoeing for a few more than that. I got really decent at the J-stroke with a "t" handled paddle. I've never even attempted it with the kayak paddle as I can easily accomodate turning with more or less twist/thrust power. I always felt more twist in the body and a little lean into the paddle would give me the necessary control. In Wind I tend to crab so that I'm going in the direction chosen. Can you point out a site or give brief description of how to do this with a kayak paddle? With the Canoe paddle I could linger a bit on the stroke, but the kayak paddle I go stroke to stroke. ScottO

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Just finish each forward stroke with a j-hook to the outside. Of course you will only bee doiing this on one side of the boat depending on wind direction. This will make a minor correction back into the wind, keeping You on a steady course. I have some excellant books You can borrow and I will look around on the web. The people that hang at www.******* are much better paddlers than I and seem to be very helpful whenever I ask them a question.

Barrell

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Hey Barrell thanks for the information. I think an easier way to counteract that effect though is to use a stronger pull on the leewar side. I think the J stroke will really mess with my rhythm. I find I just give a bit extra on the leeward side and it doesn't interupt the timing. My thoughts anyway. Scott. PS with the rudder I don't have to do that, as a little left or right will correct for the error. Scott

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If you are looking for information on paddling technique you may want to check out the Mariner Kayak site. They have their "users manual" online and it has a lot about paddling. While there are no pictures or diagrams and its the sort of thing that made my eyes glaze over about half way through, there is a lot of good hints and pointers for free. It seems to me that good paddling technique is not something to ignore for fishing because good technique means further, faster and for less effort and that means more fishing potential.

 

John

 

Mariner Kayaks Paddling Manual

 

[This message has been edited by RJohn (edited 12-17-2001).]

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