Paul_M Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Yup. Let's refine all that crude and keep it in house.... http://money.cnn.com/2011/12/05/news/economy/gasoline_export/index.htm Ultimately, I think most of this will end up China if the pipeline gets built..... China can build all the refineries it needs and more. See you on the big one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surf Hunter Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 I did. What does it say about the content of the letter sent to the landowners? Google "Transcanada Dear john Letter" , tons of info, i am late for work or I would try to post more. I believe there is a pdf of one of the letters. Be the chimp, not the frog..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraith Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Let me get this strait. So, without our govrrnment's blessing, TransCanada is sending out dear john letters regarding emminent (sp) domain. Nice. We should do that and just claim it on all of Canada making it the US and just keep all our own oil. Sounds like a solid plan. Except Transcanada is not 'taking' Land, just an 'Easement' over a section of it. I don't believe 'Government Blessing' is needed for Eminent Domain, just the Courts. * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted December 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Except Transcanada is not 'taking' Land, just an 'Easement' over a section of it. I don't believe 'Government Blessing' is needed for Eminent Domain, just the Courts. Taking an "easement" from an unwilling property owner is "taking". If one believes in the notion that a free market is best, then one would want the property owner to be able negotiate a price (or refuse) without government or court interference...right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surf Hunter Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Except Transcanada is not 'taking' Land, just an 'Easement' over a section of it. I don't believe 'Government Blessing' is needed for Eminent Domain, just the Courts. What is said "easement" is right though the center of my house? I saw an episode of Bugs Bunny and the freeway over his rabbit hole being bit that is similar. Be the chimp, not the frog..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Quote: Originally Posted by eddie Taking an "easement" from an unwilling property owner is "taking". If one believes in the notion that a free market is best, then one would want the property owner to be able negotiate a price (or refuse) without government or court interference...right? I have a question for the "libertarians of convenience". Do you want to see this pipeline built,yes or no? “My happiness is not the means to any end. It is the end. It is its own goal. It is its own purpose.” Ayn Rand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraith Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Taking an "easement" from an unwilling property owner is "taking". If one believes in the notion that a free market is best, then one would want the property owner to be able negotiate a price (or refuse) without government or court interference...right? Correct. As long as one is willing to accept the 'Consequences' of their actions. Take the Local Issue near me recently. Weavers Cove wanted to put in a NG Terminal, Locals were against it, and beat it back. In your 'Free Market', the Supplier of Natural Gas to Fall River should now be able to shut off the Gas Supply to them and sell it to others. After all, they are the owners of the Natural Gas and should be able to sell, (or refuse) without government or court interference...right? In a 'truly' Free Market, that is. Would you have a problem with this? How about the Oil Companies who would benefit for this Pipeline increasing their gas Prices by $2.50 a Gallon to compensate for it not being built? Problem with that? Dare I bring up Electricity? 'Free Market', it works both ways, like a Double Edged Sword.................... * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraith Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 What is said "easement" is right though the center of my house? I saw an episode of Bugs Bunny and the freeway over his rabbit hole being bit that is similar. In that case, if you actually did read the Letter you made reference to, you would get a New House out of it. * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Quote: Originally Posted by Wraith Correct. As long as one is willing to accept the 'Consequences' of their actions. Take the Local Issue near me recently. Weavers Cove wanted to put in a NG Terminal, Locals were against it, and beat it back. In your 'Free Market', the Supplier of Natural Gas to Fall River should now be able to shut off the Gas Supply to them and sell it to others. After all, they are the owners of the Natural Gas and should be able to sell, (or refuse) without government or court interference...right? In a 'truly' Free Market, that is. Would you have a problem with this? How about the Oil Companies who would benefit for this Pipeline increasing their gas Prices by $2.50 a Gallon to compensate for it not being built? Problem with that? Dare I bring up Electricity? 'Free Market', it works both ways, like a Double Edged Sword.................... What if people were freely allowed in the USA to drill for oil on their land? What if the government did not own half the acrreage west of the river, and a man was allowed to freely buy and use some of that land as he saw fit? Wemmay not even need that stuff from Canada. As i said-Libertarians of convenience. “My happiness is not the means to any end. It is the end. It is its own goal. It is its own purpose.” Ayn Rand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Here is a map of existing pipelines in the country. The West is already criss-crossed with energy pipelines. Why is this one, just one more to the mish mosh, so environmentally critical? Pipelines already cross the Western aquifers. Again, the eco-obstructionists are seeking to stifle any further 'carbon' based fuels. A disgusting, despicable tactic from the 'hate America first' crowd, who would rather see us shiver in the dark, than actually tackle this National Security energy issue. "I think, that all right thinking people, are sick & tired of being told that they're sick & tired of being sick & tired. I, for one, am not. And I'm sick & tired of being told that I am." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDC Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Here is a map of existing pipelines in the country. The West is already criss-crossed with energy pipelines. Why is this one, just one more to the mish mosh, so environmentally critical? Pipelines already cross the Western aquifers. Again, the eco-obstructionists are seeking to stifle any further 'carbon' based fuels. A disgusting, despicable tactic from the 'hate America first' crowd, who would rather see us shiver in the dark, than actually tackle this National Security energy issue. if the west is already criss-crossed with pipelines, then why is this one needed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 if the west is already criss-crossed with pipelines, then why is this one needed? My guess is that the existing pipelines are already at capacity. "I think, that all right thinking people, are sick & tired of being told that they're sick & tired of being sick & tired. I, for one, am not. And I'm sick & tired of being told that I am." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDC Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 My guess is that the existing pipelines are already at capacity. then simply upgrade the existing ones in the same footprint.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraith Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 then simply upgrade the existing ones in the same footprint.... What does one do with the product being Transported in the Pipeline being 'Upgraded'? If you mean laying a 'New' line next to it, you still have 'Easement' issues to deal with. * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDC Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 What does one do with the product being Transported in the Pipeline being 'Upgraded'? If you mean laying a 'New' line next to it, you still have 'Easement' issues to deal with. sure, but not as much of an impact to land owners to increase an easement vs getting a new one from someone else. Plus the infrastructure is already there (service roads and the like) so you would think it would be less expensive to do it that way. I just haven't heard anything about the "need" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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