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BowChamp

Guide layout suggestions needed

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I have a lamiglas MB108-3M to build. Will be using a Zeebaas 25, and 30lb. braid on it. I won't be using mono at all. The guides I'll be using are American tackle Typhoon, Titanium with nanolite rings. From what I've found they are, for all practical purposes, the same as fuji MN guides. Most builders in my area are old school big wire guide builders with not much knowledge of braid. This is why I need recomendations. From butt of rod to reel stem will be 19.5". The guide sizes I'm thinking about using are 40,25,20,16,10, then the rest will be 4 to 5 in size 8's. Any help with this will be greatly appreciated. Thanks

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Al, Thank you for taking the time to help me. Do you have any recommendations on the measurments for the guides from the reel out . Or at least where to start the 30 guide. Thanks

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I would start at 36-inches from the face of the spool to start. Tape the guides in place and do some test casting and a stress distribution. Adjust the stripper position as needed and then tweak the remaining guide positions.

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Any tips on what I will be looking, feeling, or listening for during the test casting.

 

There's no magic code here: just go by how well your casts do. Put your butt guide in a location, make a few casts; move it an inch one way, make a few casts; move it an inch the other way, make a few casts. Repeat as many times as you want, and if you want to get really thorough, try going up a size, and then down a size, and moving these other sizes around during test casting too.

 

If you observe your casts carefully while you're doing this, you'll begin to notice that a certain-sized guide gives you the best casts, and that there is a location where the casts go farthest. Again, there's no magic bullet here: just keep casting and testing until you find the right answer; the more casts you're willing to do, the more likely you are to get the optimum location and sizing of your butt guide.

 

Once you've figured out the butt guide, then the rest is easy: locate the rest of the guides with static distribution testing, do one last run of test casts with your final spacing (just to make sure the rod still casts well), and then wrap and finish.

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Al, Belmo, Thank you for the help. I'm getting my list of items together tonight so I can make an order. I'll definitly be back to let you know how it turns out. Again, Thanks and Merry Christmas!!!!

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regarding the stripper guide be sure and put a ood bend on the rod. with a blank that bends as deep as that one you will be giving a lot of power away if the stripper guide is to far from the reel. I would have the stripper down to 28-30 in from the reel and only move it furher away if it was needed, line getting choked , bunched at the stripper, and that shouldnt happen with braid, that reel, adn a 30 ring

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If you have the time, and you're willing to experiment, try moving the butt guide around over a large area on the rod, say from 22 inches from the reel seat out to 40 inches. Move it an inch at a time, and at each location, try a few casts and also see how the line behaves when you have the rod under load. If you want to get a gold star for thoroughness, do it multiple times, with different sized guides - for a ZB 25, try, say, a 25, a 30, and a 40. This is more experimenting than you really need to do to build one rod, but this exercise will pay dividends, in spades, in terms of the knowledge you glean from it.

 

Since you're new to this, the whole process will probably seem very confusing, almost alien, to you, but an hour or two spent testing butt guide locations will give you more knowledge than probably 90% of the builders out there. You'll see how sizing and location of the butt guide affects casting distance, and you'll also see, as Mike notes, that while placing the butt guide farther away from the reel might enable you to cast a bit farther, it will probably result in a setup that gives you a bit less leverage when you're fighting a fish (generally speaking, the closer to the reel the butt guide is, the more "lifting" power the rod will have). Building a good rod is all about tradeoffs, and the more you know about how configuring stuff will affect different performance aspects of the rod, the more you can optimize the performance of the finished rod in all areas.

 

Once you've been at this for a while, your experience will eliminate the need for a lot (though not all) of this kind of testing. But when you're new, it's very, very useful to do this kind of experimenting, and to learn this stuff for yourself, rather than relying on something you read on the internet or in a book. For this first-hand knowledge is way better than anything someone else can tell you, and learning the ropes this way, by being willing to put in the work necessary, will shorten your learning curve enormously.

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There's a new system called Guide Placement System(GPS); developed to determine guide placement.

 

While primarily designed for the Fuji 'K' guides, it will give you guide size and placement using different guides . It also computes the 27X System.

 

It will get you pretty close to the proper placement of guides. After all this is done, you may have to 'tweak' the guides. C2

 

 

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Belmo, I've got nothing but time. Would probably do me good to play around and learn something. Kind of like "On the jod training", first hand is always best.

 

 

Charlie2, I'll look into it. Thanks for the input!!!

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Keep in mind when looking at any of the lay tools or theries available they are generalizations, if they were every 9' rod with the reel you are using would have the saem guide placement. its best to understand what this layout concepts are trying to acheive and then use common sense. in addition you want to consider how the rod performs when fighting a fish (i know I mentioned it earlier, you will fnd i say this alot). a lot of these discussions tend to be focused on casting alone. IMHO the guide layout will have a much more drastic effect on the fighting of a fish and support of the blank than ever will in casting

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I totally agree. I tend to over-guide a rod for both surf and boats rods. The proper number of guides, size and guide placement are critical in maximizing both casting and fish fighting performance.

 

 

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