AP Reports on Obamination Lies in Speech

[Whopper Bubba]

By CALVIN WOODWARD, Associated Press Writer Calvin Woodward, Associated Press Writer, Wed Jun 16, 6:19 am ET

WASHINGTON, In assuring Americans that BP won't control the compensation fund for Gulf oil spill recovery, President Barack Obama failed to mention that the government won't control it, either.

That means it's anyone's guess whether the government can, in fact, make BP pay all costs related to the spill.

Obama aimed high in his prime-time Oval Office address Tuesday night - perhaps higher than the facts support and history teaches - as he vowed to restore livelihoods and nature from the still-unfolding calamity in the Gulf of Mexico.

A look at some of his statements and how they compare with those facts:

OBAMA: "We will make BP pay for the damage their company has caused and we will do whatever's necessary to help the Gulf Coast and its people recover from this tragedy. ... Tomorrow, I will meet with the chairman of BP and inform him that he is to set aside whatever resources are required to compensate the workers and business owners who have been harmed as a result of his company's recklessness. And this fund will not be controlled by BP. In order to ensure that all legitimate claims are paid out in a fair and timely manner, the account must and will be administered by an independent, third party."

THE FACTS: An independent arbiter is no more bound to the government's wishes than an oil company's. In that sense, there is no certainty BP will be forced to make the Gulf economy whole again or that taxpayers are off the hook for the myriad costs associated with the spill or cleanup. The government can certainly press for that, using legislative and legal tools. But there are no guarantees and the past is not reassuring.

It took 20 years to sort through liability after the Exxon Valdez oil spill in Alaska, and in the end, punitive damages were slashed by the courts to about $500 million from $2.5 billion. Many people who had lost their livelihoods in the spill died without ever seeing a check.

___

OBAMA: "In the coming days and weeks, these efforts should capture up to 90 percent of the oil leaking out of the well."

THE FACTS: BP and the administration contend that if all goes as planned, they should be able to contain nearly 90 percent of the worst-case oil flow. But that's a big "if." So far, little has gone as planned in the various remedies attempted to shut off or contain the flow. Possibly as much as 60,000 barrels a day is escaping. BP would need to nearly triple its recovery rate to reach the target.

___

OBAMA: Temporary measures will capture leaking oil "until the company finishes drilling a relief well later in the summer that is expected to stop the leak completely."

THE FACTS: That's the hope, but experts say the relief well runs the same risks that caused the original well to blow out. It potentially could create a worse spill if engineers were to accidentally damage the existing well or tear a hole in the undersea oil reservoir.

___

OBAMA: "From the very beginning of this crisis, the federal government has been in charge of the largest environmental cleanup effort in our nation's history."

THE FACTS: Early on, the government established a command center and put Coast Guard Adm. Thad Allen in charge of coordinating the overall spill response. But officials also repeatedly have emphasized that BP was "responsible" and they have relied heavily on BP in making decisions from hiring cleanup workers to what oil dispersing chemicals to use. Local officials in the Gulf region have complained that often they don't know who's in charge - the government or BP.

___

 

OBAMA: "We have approved the construction of new barrier islands in Louisiana to try and stop the oil before it reaches the shore."

THE FACTS: Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal and local officials pleaded for weeks with the Army Corps of Engineers and the spill response command for permission to build about 40 miles of sand berms along the barrier islands.

State officials applied for an emergency permit to build the berms May 11, but as days went by Jindal became increasingly angry at federal inaction. The White House finally agreed to a portion of the berm plan on June 2. BP then agreed to pay for the project.

The corps was worried that in some cases such a move would alter tides and drive oil into new areas and produce more harm than good.

___

OBAMA: "Already, I have issued a six-month moratorium on deepwater drilling. I know this creates difficulty for the people who work on these rigs, but for the sake of their safety and for the sake of the entire region, we need to know the facts before we allow deepwater drilling to continue." THE FACTS: Obama issued a six-month moratorium on new permits for deepwater drilling but production continues from existing deepwater wells.

[Whopper Bubba]

Probably the most aggregious lie, and there's no other word for it, were the President's false words about BP's ability to control the well and retrieve the oil.

 

 

quote:

In the coming weeks and days, these efforts should capture up to 90% of the oil leaking out of the well. This is until the company finishes drilling a relief well later in the summer that is expected to stop the leak completely.

 

As the AP points out, these are simply over-optimisic hopes. And they are based upon some very faulty and naive assumptions about what is a worst-case or near worst-case scenario.

 

There is a very real possibility that the B.O.P can collapse the well due to erosion before any relief wells can be drilled. And the fact that BP abandoned Top Kill and instead tried to increase flow out of the well by cutting off the riser indicates erosion is occurring. Because that's an attempt to relieve pressure on the downwell erosion.

 

If the BOP preventer collapses, the best possible scenario is that the wellbore leading to the reservoir of oil would be exposed, and we'd just have to deal with a gusher. Which some estimates predict a potential for a flowrate of 150,000 barrels. But that would relieve the pressure so that downwell damage slows and this thing can still be killed from the bottom with relief wells.

 

Worse scenarios could mean include of the chambers that make up the entire field could bleed out, a collapse of the sea floor over a chamber, or the entire field could bleed out. BP estimates there are approximately 2.5 billion barrels in the reservoir in four chambers.

 

BP is sonically mapping the sea bed to monitor the situation. Erosion is a very real concern. BP knows it. The government knows it. And they both aren't telling us the truth about the situation.

 

Whether Obama knows it, or could even understand it if someone tried to explain it to him, is debatable. But he's part of the conspiracy to lie through ommission, and polish this turd so it doesn't make him and his administration look so pathetically out of their depth. As the clip with Krauthammer notes, it's not working. The Obama administration is the most transparent in history; just not in the way they intended when they first applied the term to themselves.

 

Normally I'd get more pleasure out of the fact that not only can't Obama's friends in the media keep lid on truth: Obama's incompetent but, as the AP story and the reactions of Olbermann and Matthews reveal, many aren't even trying to keep the lid on the truth anymore.

 

But I can't really enjoy it because of of potential magnitude of this disaster. It's gobsmacking that the Obama administration gave BP a comprehensive waiver from environment waivers due to the "limited potential" for harm, and now it's not only what Obama terms the worst environmental disaster in our history but could realistically become awful beyond imagination. And the only thing that prompts Obama into action is his overwhelming concern for his own image and keeping information tightly controlled.

[fish'nmagician]

it's pretty weak to call any of those "lies". Just so I am clear if you look at the statement and look at the rebuttle it doesn't seem to meet the standard of LIE.

[NS Mike D]

By CALVIN WOODWARD, Associated Press Writer Calvin Woodward, Associated Press Writer, Wed Jun 16, 6:19 am ET

WASHINGTON, In assuring Americans that BP won't control the compensation fund for Gulf oil spill recovery, President Barack Obama failed to mention that the government won't control it, either.

That means it's anyone's guess whether the government can, in fact, make BP pay all costs related to the spill.

Obama aimed high in his prime-time Oval Office address Tuesday night - perhaps higher than the facts support and history teaches - as he vowed to restore livelihoods and nature from the still-unfolding calamity in the Gulf of Mexico.

A look at some of his statements and how they compare with those facts:

OBAMA: "We will make BP pay for the damage their company has caused and we will do whatever's necessary to help the Gulf Coast and its people recover from this tragedy. ... Tomorrow, I will meet with the chairman of BP and inform him that he is to set aside whatever resources are required to compensate the workers and business owners who have been harmed as a result of his company's recklessness. And this fund will not be controlled by BP. In order to ensure that all legitimate claims are paid out in a fair and timely manner, the account must and will be administered by an independent, third party."

THE FACTS: An independent arbiter is no more bound to the government's wishes than an oil company's. In that sense, there is no certainty BP will be forced to make the Gulf economy whole again or that taxpayers are off the hook for the myriad costs associated with the spill or cleanup. The government can certainly press for that, using legislative and legal tools. But there are no guarantees and the past is not reassuring.

It took 20 years to sort through liability after the Exxon Valdez oil spill in Alaska, and in the end, punitive damages were slashed by the courts to about $500 million from $2.5 billion. Many people who had lost their livelihoods in the spill died without ever seeing a check.

___

OBAMA: "In the coming days and weeks, these efforts should capture up to 90 percent of the oil leaking out of the well."

THE FACTS: BP and the administration contend that if all goes as planned, they should be able to contain nearly 90 percent of the worst-case oil flow. But that's a big "if." So far, little has gone as planned in the various remedies attempted to shut off or contain the flow. Possibly as much as 60,000 barrels a day is escaping. BP would need to nearly triple its recovery rate to reach the target.

___

OBAMA: Temporary measures will capture leaking oil "until the company finishes drilling a relief well later in the summer that is expected to stop the leak completely."

THE FACTS: That's the hope, but experts say the relief well runs the same risks that caused the original well to blow out. It potentially could create a worse spill if engineers were to accidentally damage the existing well or tear a hole in the undersea oil reservoir.

___

OBAMA: "From the very beginning of this crisis, the federal government has been in charge of the largest environmental cleanup effort in our nation's history."

THE FACTS: Early on, the government established a command center and put Coast Guard Adm. Thad Allen in charge of coordinating the overall spill response. But officials also repeatedly have emphasized that BP was "responsible" and they have relied heavily on BP in making decisions from hiring cleanup workers to what oil dispersing chemicals to use. Local officials in the Gulf region have complained that often they don't know who's in charge - the government or BP.

___

 

OBAMA: "We have approved the construction of new barrier islands in Louisiana to try and stop the oil before it reaches the shore."

THE FACTS: Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal and local officials pleaded for weeks with the Army Corps of Engineers and the spill response command for permission to build about 40 miles of sand berms along the barrier islands.

State officials applied for an emergency permit to build the berms May 11, but as days went by Jindal became increasingly angry at federal inaction. The White House finally agreed to a portion of the berm plan on June 2. BP then agreed to pay for the project.

The corps was worried that in some cases such a move would alter tides and drive oil into new areas and produce more harm than good.

___

OBAMA: "Already, I have issued a six-month moratorium on deepwater drilling. I know this creates difficulty for the people who work on these rigs, but for the sake of their safety and for the sake of the entire region, we need to know the facts before we allow deepwater drilling to continue." THE FACTS: Obama issued a six-month moratorium on new permits for deepwater drilling but production continues from existing deepwater wells.

 

 

 

I don't have the energy to read the who article as I stopped at the lie at the very top.

 

In fact, this is a lie that several members tried to perpetuate in another thread - yet the evidence it was a lie was contained in the very article that was quoted.

 

 

The use of an INDEPENDANT ENTITY to handle the claims was mentioned by Obama at least three times in the one paragraph of the artcle posted in yesterday's thread.

 

It saddend me that so many lies and fallacies are posted here on a dialy basis, clogging the way for an open discussion.

[fishinambition]

He said things that werent true with the clear intention of misleading people. How's that not a lie?

[Whopper Bubba]

"There is no error so malicious that it fails to find defenders."

[fish'nmagician]

OBAMA: "We have approved the construction of new barrier islands in Louisiana to try and stop the oil before it reaches the shore."

THE FACTS: Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal and local officials pleaded for weeks with the Army Corps of Engineers and the spill response command for permission to build about 40 miles of sand berms along the barrier islands.

State officials applied for an emergency permit to build the berms May 11, but as days went by Jindal became increasingly angry at federal inaction. The White House finally agreed to a portion of the berm plan on June 2. BP then agreed to pay for the project.

The corps was worried that in some cases such a move would alter tides and drive oil into new areas and produce more harm than good.

 

 

It's a lie IF they haven't approved the construction,

nothing in what is written makes it a LIE,

unless it hasn't really been approved yet.

[NS Mike D]

He said things that werent true with the clear intention of misleading people. How's that not a lie?

 

 

 

as for an independant arbiter, an independant arbiter cannot circumvent CERCLA and releated laws that bind BP and other responsible parties from their obligations.

 

These laws ARE the wishes of the government.

 

 

so in this case, there is no misleading or lie by the POTUS, just a misleading opinion from the author.

[fish'nmagician]

OBAMA: "In the coming days and weeks, these efforts should capture up to 90 percent of the oil leaking out of the well."

THE FACTS: BP and the administration contend that if all goes as planned, they should be able to contain nearly 90 percent of the worst-case oil flow. But that's a big "if." So far, little has gone as planned in the various remedies attempted to shut off or contain the flow. Possibly as much as 60,000 barrels a day is escaping. BP would need to nearly triple its recovery rate to reach the target.

 

 

at worst he is being foolishly optimistic based on BP's history of deception.

but this does NOT appear to be a lie.

[fish'nmagician]

OBAMA: Temporary measures will capture leaking oil "until the company finishes drilling a relief well later in the summer that is expected to stop the leak completely."

THE FACTS: That's the hope, but experts say the relief well runs the same risks that caused the original well to blow out. It potentially could create a worse spill if engineers were to accidentally damage the existing well or tear a hole in the undersea oil reservoir.

___

 

 

the facts do not disprove the assertion.

[NS Mike D]

In the coming days and weeks, these efforts should capture up to 90 percent of the oil leaking out of the well

 

does anyone not understand that IF these efforts don't work as planned in the days and weeks to come, that 90% of the oil leaking will not be captured.

[fishinambition]

oops nevermind

[Whopper Bubba]

"There is no error so monstrous that it fails to find defenders."

[Surf Hunter]

Well I'll be, it looks like BP just put 20 billion in an account today for oil disaster claims. Guess the snippet below was not a lie.

 

OBAMA: "We will make BP pay for the damage their company has caused and we will do whatever's necessary to help the Gulf Coast and its people recover from this tragedy. ... Tomorrow, I will meet with the chairman of BP and inform him that he is to set aside whatever resources are required to compensate the workers and business owners who have been harmed as a result of his company's recklessness. And this fund will not be controlled by BP. In order to ensure that all legitimate claims are paid out in a fair and timely manner, the account must and will be administered by an independent, third party."

THE FACTS: An independent arbiter is no more bound to the government's wishes than an oil company's. In that sense, there is no certainty BP will be forced to make the Gulf economy whole again or that taxpayers are off the hook for the myriad costs associated with the spill or cleanup. The government can certainly press for that, using legislative and legal tools. But there are no guarantees and the past is not reassuring.

It took 20 years to sort through liability after the Exxon Valdez oil spill in Alaska, and in the end, punitive damages were slashed by the courts to about $500 million from $2.5 billion. Many people who had lost their livelihoods in the spill died without ever seeing a check.

[NS Mike D]

oops nevermind

 

 

 

that's ok, sometime I don't even know what I post