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GOP's Civil War

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Jonesy

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Rod Dreher nails it in my opinion. If the GOP doesn't wake up then they will continue to lose ground.

 

 

 

Rod Dreher: Here comes the conservative civil war

 

 

07:31 PM CST on Friday, November 7, 2008

 

 

And so, with a resounding, bone-rattling crash, the conservative era ends. Now the scattered and demoralized armies of the right will turn on each other with such ferocity it will make the brutal opening scene of Gladiator look like a slap fight at a slumber party. It's about to get mercenary in the woodshed.

 

Who lost conservatism? The first instinct among shell-shocked and infuriated partisans will be to blame anybody but their own faction for this historical repudiation. Look to the talk-radio mob to set upon conservative elites who failed to stay loyally on side, especially in the matter of Sarah Palin's candidacy. This will do nobody any good and will delay the necessary repentance, rethinking and rebuilding.

 

 

The right has developed a vicious habit of tagging any dissenting conservative as a closet liberal. This folly has constructed an airtight bubble around the GOP and conservative leaders, not only depriving conservatism of constructive criticism from within its ranks, but also reinforcing the rank-and-file's worst instincts. If the election results didn't convince Republicans that they couldn't afford to throw people out, especially their intellectuals and people who respect intellect, then their ignorance is invincible.

 

This election ought to once and for all teach conservatives that Ronald Reagan is dead, and he's not coming back. The intellectual poverty of the GOP primary debates showed itself by the candidates' ritualistic invocation of Mr. Reagan's name, as if saying it often enough would compensate for the lack of new ideas among the sorry bunch.

 

Mr. Reagan and his popular brand of conservatism arose out of a particular set of historical circumstances, specifically, the challenge of Soviet communism abroad and welfare-statism at home. It's a new day with new challenges, and the intellectually exhausted right is not up to meeting them.

 

Conservatives must return to the philosophical sources of our tradition and reinterpret its insights and truths for the world we live in now. Ideas really do have consequences, as, obviously, does the lack of same. Yes, conservatives have to oppose the Obama Democrats when they overreach, but if the only response conservatives offer is defensive and obstreperous, they will not soon recover.

 

Conservatives will go nowhere until the right owns up to the failures of the Bush years. They were chiefly a failure of competence and a corruption of professed ideals. They were also a failure of ideology. In particular:

 

"¢The idea that the American military is an omnipotent tool for spreading liberal democracy died in Iraq and Afghanistan. The right's romanticization of militarism, and its crusading pieties about the universality of democratic values, are done.

 

"¢The dogmatic conviction that the globalized free market is capable of regulating itself for the greater good of society is a spectacularly costly shibboleth, as even Alan Greenspan, the high priest of this religion, confessed recently.

 

"¢The GOP's knee-jerk hostility to environmental concerns is not only a betrayal of conservative tradition but also costs Republicans credibility with young voters. Similarly, though it's tough for social conservatives like me to admit it, we've lost the gay marriage battle, especially among the young. We're going to have to come to some sort of accommodation with it to protect religious liberty.

 

The good news is that Mr. Obama may be a liberal, but he did not campaign as one and is too smart to govern as one. America remains largely a center-right country, which means there are opportunities for new iterations of conservatism. All eyes should be on Louisiana's brilliant young governor, Bobby Jindal, as the one national Republican left standing who can shore up the fragments against conservatism's present ruin, and possibly reverse the tide.

 

Out of loss, new victories can arise. Modern American conservatism began with the crushing defeat of Arizona's Barry Goldwater in the 1964 presidential race. That laid the groundwork for an emerging conservative movement, one that would not fully arrive until the Reagan presidency set the political agenda for nearly 30 years.

 

It is poetic, even poignant, that conservatism ended its remarkable run with the failed 2008 presidential effort of the Arizona senator who succeeded Mr. Goldwater. It took 16 years to get from Mr. Goldwater to Mr. Reagan.

The duration of conservatism's exile from power depends on how long its civil war lasts, and who wins it.

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Jindal stands out as an intelligent, well educated, young, accomplished, conservative catholic, articulate, and charismatic bright spot.

 

In an essay Jindal wrote in 1994 for the New Oxford Review, a serious right-wing Catholic journal, Jindal narrated a bizarre story of a personal encounter with a demon, in which he participated in an exorcism with a group of college friends.

 

And not only did they cast out the supernatural spirit that had possessed his friend, Jindal wrote that he believes that their ritual may well have cured her cancer. (TPM Election Central)

 

If he can cast out spirits and cure cancer then he should be president....

You think health care is expensive now?
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I don't agree with Dreher's opinion. He does two things in this article. He tries to take away Reagan from conservatives even though Reagan was the last truly successful Republican president in the last 50 years (Hmmm I smell motive).

 

He also tries to tell us that Obama ran a centrist campaign. Uh, pass the Kool Aid.

 

The Republican Party has been weak since Reagan left office. The biggest problem with the Republican party is the moderates. It's the moderates and their friends on the left who told us we needed to stop running conservatives for high office and bring more openess to the party.

 

Look where that led us: George Bush (41) was no Reagan, he was a moderate, a classic go-along-to get-along guy who could not get elected to a second term.

 

Next up: Bob Dole. Oh brother, another moderate Republican that wanted to play the cocktail circuit and not make anyone mad. Yeah, that was a great idea. He tanked.

 

Next up: George W. Bush, another go-along-to-get-along-guy, not a conservative by a longshot. He had to be shamed into putting a conservative on the Supreme Court. He spent money like a drunken sailor and refused to veto anything with the grand hopes af making the liberal Democrats like him. How did that work?

 

Well, look where we are now, John McCain, a fine man, a true American hero, but a politician through and through. He just wants to get along with the other Senators and he can't stand religious conservatives. Hmmmm, have we heard this before?

 

There of the last four Republican candidates have been men who were well liked by the moderates and their desperate need to feel accepted by Democrats and become a big-tent party. Let's face it folks, listening to these milk-toast moderates has CAUSED the downfall of the Republican party. They are the ones who have destroyed this party.

 

The Republicans need a conservative candidate that loves the Constitution and wants to see American return to our roots. We need a candidate who is unapologetic about true conservative values and will stop listening to the caterwauling of those who want another Bob Dole........another Bush..........another McCain............heck if you listen to them, we'll be running Joe Lieberman in 2012 !

 

Now here's the question. After the gullible Republicans nominated McCain......another moderate what happened? Who did the liberals and moderates vote for?

 

That's right, they voted for Obama! In overwhelming numbers.

 

The Republicans need to get back to their conservative roots.

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View PostI don't agree with Dreher's opinion. He does two things in this article. He tries to take away Reagan from conservatives even though Reagan was the last truly successful Republican president in the last 50 years (Hmmm I smell motive).

 

He also tries to tell us that Obama ran a centrist campaign. Uh, pass the Kool Aid.

 

The Republican Party has been weak since Reagan left office. The biggest problem with the Republican party is the moderates. It's the moderates and their friends on the left who told us we needed to stop running conservatives for high office and bring more openess to the party.

 

Look where that led us: George Bush (41) was no Reagan, he was a moderate, a classic go-along-to get-along guy who could not get elected to a second term.

 

Next up: Bob Dole. Oh brother, another moderate Republican that wanted to play the cocktail circuit and not make anyone mad. Yeah, that was a great idea. He tanked.

 

Next up: George W. Bush, another go-along-to-get-along-guy, not a conservative by a longshot. He had to be shamed into putting a conservative on the Supreme Court. He spent money like a drunken sailor and refused to veto anything with the grand hopes af making the liberal Democrats like him. How did that work?

 

Well, look where we are now, John McCain, a fine man, a true American hero, but a politician through and through. He just wants to get along with the other Senators and he can't stand religious conservatives. Hmmmm, have we heard this before?

 

The last four Republican candidates have been men who were well liked by the moderates and their desperate need to feel accepted by Democrats and become a big-tent party. Let's face it folks, listening to these milk-toast moderates has CAUSED the downfall of the Republican party. They are the ones who have destroyed this party.

 

The Republicans need a conservative candidate that loves the Constitution and wants to see American return to our roots. We need a candidate who is unapologetic about true conservative values and will stop listening to the caterwauling of those who want another Bob Dole........another Bush..........another McCain............heck if you listen to them, we'll be running Joe Lieberman in 2012 !

 

Now here's the question. After the gullible Republicans nominated McCain......another moderate what happened? Who did the liberals and moderates vote for?

 

That's right, they voted for Obama! In overwhelming numbers.

 

The Republicans need to get back to their conservative roots.

 

 

clapping.gif Cold, hard fiscal conservativism.

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It's almost funny. These days old white politicians couldn't get invited to a bucket brigade if the house was burning down.

 

The GOP seems to be frantically looking around for their Obama. "We have colored people, too!"

 

Nothing against Jindal, he may be fine, but I would suggest thinking more about the problems with their message than the color or the sex of their messenger.

 

By the way, why didn't McCain pick Jindal?

You think health care is expensive now?
Wait until it's free.
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View Post

 

The Republicans need a conservative candidate that loves the Constitution and wants to see American return to our roots. We need a candidate who is unapologetic about true conservative values and will stop listening to the caterwauling of those who want another Bob Dole........another Bush..........another McCain............heck if you listen to them, we'll be running Joe Lieberman in 2012 ! .............

 

The Republicans need to get back to their conservative roots.

 

just curious, what are your "roots"? and what are "conservative values"?

 

I ask because it seems to me that much of the more conservative platform of the GOP is not conservatism at all but the imposition of personal values onto the public.

"I'm not talkin' 'bout pleasure boatin'. I'm not talkin' 'bout day sailin'. I'm talkin' 'bout workin' for a livin'. I'm talkin' 'bout shahkin'!"
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What are the roots?

 

Well for starters we need a president who doesn't spend money like drunken sailor!

 

We need politicians who want an efficient government which stays OUT of our personal lives. We need someone who believes in the Constitution the way it was written. If it has to be changed it should be changed by the Amendment process and not by activist judges.

 

We need one who believes in lower taxes, a smaller footprint beyond our borders, no more venturous wars, and someone who will protect us from real threats.

 

Other then that we need a strong motivational leader. That's one reason Palin won't be the nominee in 2012.

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View PostIt's almost funny. These days old white politicians couldn't get invited to a bucket brigade if the house was burning down.

 

The GOP seems to be frantically looking around for their Obama. "We have colored people, too!"

 

Nothing against Jindal, he may be fine, but I would suggest thinking more about the problems with their message than the color or the sex of their messenger.

 

By the way, why didn't McCain pick Jindal?

 

pretty ignorant remarks- just keep going with it though - it shows you have no clue what you are talking about - you will soon reach Skitterpop status

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View PostI prefer a Palin/Lieberman ticket. With those two voices peeling paint the future of the Republican party is assured.

 

Besides Jindal's a Muslim. All those "colored" people are, you know.wink.gif

 

 

Jindal's religious root is Hindi, not Islamic. He is a converted Roman Catholic.

 

The Republican Party's future rests in a real return to fiscal Conservatism, ( a rather hard sell after the Bush era betrayals), along with sustained, albeit slightly restrained, measures of Social Conservatism. Destroy, via ignoring, your political base and you build anew on a base of sand. Suicidal folly at best. 'Moderatism' ('progressivism' Lite), is NOT the future of the Republican Party.

 

Listening to Socialist 'progressives' preach to Republicans on how to rebuild their Party, is like listening to a jackal telling a farmer how to rebuild his chicken coop. Absolute lunacy. kooky.gifcwm27.gif

"I think, that all right thinking people, are sick & tired of being told that they're sick & tired of being sick & tired. I, for one, am not. And I'm sick & tired of being told that I am."
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View PostWhat are the roots?

 

Well for starters we need a president who doesn't spend money like drunken sailor!

 

We need politicians who want an efficient government which stays OUT of our personal lives. We need someone who believes in the Constitution the way it was written. If it has to be changed it should be changed by the Amendment process and not by activist judges.

 

We need one who believes in lower taxes, a smaller footprint beyond our borders, no more venturous wars, and someone who will protect us from real threats.

 

Other then that we need a strong motivational leader. That's one reason Palin won't be the nominee in 2012.

 

except for the activist judges part of your answer, i quite agree. but that's a topic for another thread.

 

do you then believe that the GOP has to shed some of the current ties to/influence from the evangelical right?

"I'm not talkin' 'bout pleasure boatin'. I'm not talkin' 'bout day sailin'. I'm talkin' 'bout workin' for a livin'. I'm talkin' 'bout shahkin'!"
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