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Prefessa

Need Braid Advice, What # test

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Guys:

 

A recent Cod trip has renewed my interest in braid. I have been burned from my previous attempts to use braid in the surf so I need some advice here.

 

For throwing big jigs for cod on Stellwagen Bank I ignored the # test and just went with the thinnest braid that my tackle would handle without trouble, so I wound up fishing 80 and 100# test with 50# leader fishing down to the strenght of my leader. This worked fine. I clobered the cod without becoming, "That guy in the bow with that annoying braided line."

 

This mentality would have me using 50/12 braid on my spinning outfit and 65/16 on my conventional. Again, there is a big difference between throwing jigs underhand 100 ft and throwing a lure overhand 100 yards.

 

What is the mindset in the surf? What pound test braids are recomended here(spinning and conventional)? My spin outfit usually gets spooled with 15# Big Game and my Abu 6500 CT with 17# Silver Thread.

 

Any thoughts?

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On my small plugging rod 15# ripcord and 20# fluro leader. On the heavy spinner 50# whiplash and 20-30# fluro leaders. On my Mag elite 50# whiplash or 45# gudebrod with a 30# fluro leader. Thes eset ups work well for me in the surf.......Tim's set ips are simlar as I learned this from him biggrin.gif thanks Tim, glad I listened to ya. One thing braids take alittle getting accusomted to once you do you wont want to go back biggrin.gif

 

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John M

johnm@stripersonline.com

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Prefessa... If you want maximum sensitivity with good casting distance, and +300 yds capacity, Why dont you try PowerPro in 30/8 lbs?. Just don't put too much pressure in the fish first run to minimize the risk of the line digging.

 

If you want to increase considerably line capacity, with the same sensitivity as mono, you could try the same 30 lb PowerPro with a 15 - 20 lb mono top shot as long as your longer cast.

 

I know some people don't like PowerPro, but I very satisfied with the performance of it.

If you used Alberto's knot you will get a knot near the breaking strenght of the line.

 

I respect the opinion of some very experienced fishermen that use heavier braided line, and I think that it might be the best under certain special conditions, but generally speaking, I feel 30 lb braided is the most I should spool 6500 type reel with.

 

I have not used 30 lb PowerPro on the big roosters and the biggest fish I have caught with it is a 36 lb snook, but I am sure it will respond to my expectations when I hook a +50 lb rooster. I know that you don't need this advise but I will mention again that most of the "failures" when using relatively thin braided lines (like 30 lb PowerPro) are caused by poor splicing.

 

Hope this helps

 

Sergio

 

 

[This message has been edited by Sergio (edited 05-04-2000).]

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Hello,

For what it's worth... Since the inception of these high tech lines, I had the privilege of testing many braided brands and it has definitely changed the way people fish today. During its process, I've had my shares of rods breaking, guide ripping and cutting. Now, I personally use braid lines almost exclusively (except big offshore) and it has many advantages and disadvantages. The disadvantages comes from the learning process (breaking rods, ripping the hook out of fishes mouth, cut fingers to the bone, having to loosen the drag, not to strike the fish too hard and not to put too much pressure). But ultimately, it is great!

 

FYI: As previously mentioned, most old boat users / mates despise high tech line user for the most obvious reasons, when line is tangled.... It's extremely difficult to undo (especially during a hot bite), it also cuts through their line with great ease and the bottom line is (no pun intended), they simply never tried it.They don't know what they are missing.

 

In the event you like to wreck / bottom fish, (conventional) these lines are a blessing... it is incredibly sensitive! I've caught my share of big Tautogs, Cod, Grouper, Cows Linesiders and Snook!

You will also find it as rewarding when you use it for spinning outfits! It definitely gives you an edge, (greater casting distance due to line diameters) and it also gives you the confidence when the dream fish comes along when she smacks your lure!

 

Now, as for conventional gear, I generally use 50 braid for most boat fishing.... And when I surfcast... I generally use no more then 30! You really don't need that much torque in the suds unless there are major structures around.... Then I go heavier!

 

Anyway, this is my 2 cents worth!

 

Tight Lines!

"Crazy" Alberto

Ps: Sergio, Thanks for giving my knot a plug. wink.gif

 

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I like the Berkley Whiplash when it comes to braids, I've tried various types of braids and the Whiplash is by far my favorite.

 

On the Small spinning outfit for the surf, flinging small plugs and teasers I use the #30 Whiplash, on the 10 1/2' spinning rod for the long hauls I use the #50 Whiplash, Conventional #65 Whiplash and on the heavy Bridge tackle #80 Whiplash.

 

Always use a leader lighter than the braid that your using, this will prevent bottom litter when you get hung up. biggrin.gif

 

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Dubs a.k.a., Charlie

dubs@stripersonline.com

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Guys: Thanks for all of your wisdom.

 

Alberto: You are right! The party boat "Old Guard" gernerally shuns braid, even though they never used it. I found that a small mono top shot usually takes care of 90+% of the tangles, which usually occur near your terminal gear.

 

Dubs: For spinning applications, do you tie the braid to your swivel and then go to say 3-4 ft of mono to a snap or do you use say 6-8 ft of mono topshot tied with an albright or Uni-Uni splice?

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20# PowerPro in the suds with a 30-40# Jinkai or Suffix Fluorocarbon leader. This is the best setup I have found for plugging....with a spinning rod. I have used 30# PP but found that there was a marked difference in my casting distance...especially with lighter lures.

 

Try it....you'll like it.

 

------------------

DC<=><

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Call me blasphemous, but I'll case my vote for good ole fashion 30lb Spiderwire on the spinner. It's like Bud longnecks: Not fancy, but it's reliable and it gets the job done. I had so many problems with Whiplash that I named it "Backlash". Magibraid earned the honor of "Tragibraid" because it would separate for no apparent reason, and it's not round, but rather, ribbon-shaped.

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DaveC....yessir, that's a fine pluggin in the sand rig...but if ya hook the bottom 80 yds out, your briad will part long before the 30-40# fluoro...and the problem with that is you have no way of controlling or even guessing where it will break. You can lose 80yds of braid instead of 4ft of fluoro by not having stronger braid than leader. In the pure sand environ, not an issue...but rocks, pilings, bridges, or anything on the bottom...and yer spools gonna get low...quick!

 

**I wrote this early this morning, but the server went down, I'm posting it now***

 

I'm with Dubs in the line choices here (imagine that? wink.gif) The issue, at least locally, with using only 30# braid is that you are then only able to use up to 20# fluoro for a leader...otherwise, when you get hung up (and you will) you risk busting your braid instead of your leader. 20# fluoro and 30# braid break close enough to each other as the mono is under rated and the braids are over rated....15# fluoro would be better! By using 50# braid, you can now get away with a 30# fluoro leader...a much nicer number when you got the rod well bent and something with shoulders is headed for trouble!

 

The Whiplash 30# is substantially thinner than even 10# mono...I stuffed 300yds of 30 onto a spinning reel capable only of 210 yds of 10# mono...so I'm guessing the 30# Whiplash is about 5# test mono equivalent. And you won't have to worry about it "digging in" as described above with the other line you mentioned (I'm not sayin' it....this way DaveC and I won't get into another one of "those" debates wink.gif)

 

So, if you can put 50# Whiplash on and still maintain enough line capacity to stop a monster, why bother with 30#? biggrin.gif

 

TimS

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I agree with Alberto about a learning curve (that can be shortened with good advise such as the one you can get in this forum) when changing from mono to superline.

 

I never broke a rod or ripped a guide as Alberto confessed, but I did grooved guides that I though never would (not the very best guides by the way). My choice for practically all of my fishing (except where aiming to break a record) is a superline and lately more a braided one than a fused one.

One point I have not mentioned, is that IMO 30lb PowerPro of 8 lb mono diameter does not flies as well as 8 lb mono line. Of course it flies much, much farther than 30 lb mono, but some of the people that have not used superline might think that similar diameter braided line compares equally with mono in this aspect.

 

TimS... I hope I don't bother someone mentioning what I use, knowing that what I say is regarding fishing for snooks, snappers and roosterfish and other Pacific critters and not stripers smile.gif

But even knowing of that risk, here are my 2 MX cents worth that are worth about 0.2 US cents after too many devaluations crying.gif

 

I respect the choice, can understand and have used many times TimS and Dubs strategy, that could maybe be called an "aimed breaking strategy" to save line, in this case as TimS suggests using a lower breaking strength mono leader.

The reason about why I use 30 lb mono and a higher strength mono leader even where there is a possibility of a hung up is:

 

Lower diameter line gives me more distance and I never know when that extra difference will make THE difference.

I have been spooled many times, but have seen many more times a huge mystery fish strip all of my friend's reel, fishing with less line than me and the questions and comments arise.... "Was that a 65lb world record black snook?... Of course it was not a snagged ray for Pete's sake!!!... I know perfectly well how large rays fight!!!... Or was that a 70lb cubera snapper?, and so it goes.

Getting spooled by a mistery fish that pulls ALL your line out is a heart shrinking experience,especially when you never get a glimpse of it and IMO it is easier to get spooled using a 6500 sized reel or similar capacity spinning reel when filled with 50, 65 lb. test braided line than with 30 lb. test line. The reason is that the rods used with this too high test line and the drag of these type of reels (even with an expert thumb helping) are not designed to make full use of that higher line strength. (Un)fortunatelly the getting spooled scenario by a huge monster is a possibility where I fish.

 

Loosing braided line because of using a higher strength leader is of course a posibility as Tim S suggested, but I do not expect my braided line to brake in other place but in the knot. This is not because I tie bad knots, sino al contrario[i/], I tie well chosen knots that break very near the breaking strenght of the line, but the knot is without doubt the weakest link between the mono leader and the braided line (if both lines are in good condition). If the braided line brakes in a snag after the splice knot, I will feel better than if it did on a fish. Lucky that the maimed superline, broke on the snag than on a big fish. I see it as a good thing (well... almost smile.gif).

In reality it is very unusual for a superline I am using to break far behind the knot, because I aways use superline in relatively good condition every time I go fishing. If I know that the superline was weakened by a rock the last time I fished, I will take it all out with a mechanical devise and will just put the corresponding mono in the bottom of the spool to substitute the loss (I don't make mono conections below the superline). This mono is also good so that the line does not slips, so it wont bother me unless it is more than 50 yds. Once I loose that much superline, I will just cut most worn part of the superline and use it on a smaller capacity reel. Yes, I do a lot of line changing, and it can add up, but after too many trophy fish lost, it is very difficult for you to find me in the water with a spool of line not in prime condition, even if that means changing spools during the day.

I have many more comments regarding this, but this post is already too long wink.gif.

 

Buena suerte, and I hope I translated correctly all biggrin.gif.

 

Sergio

 

 

Sergio, please don't take offense to my editing your post! I just read it, it's a fine piece of work...'cept I needed to remove one instance of using the Lord's name in vain! I know, many folks use that phrase casually and you can hear it all day on television...I'd just prefer it not used here! Again, no offense intended...very possibly, something was lost in translation ;^)....excellent post...I wish I could get spooled around here?!?! biggrin.gif

 

TimS

 

[This message has been edited by TimS (edited 05-08-2000).]

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Professa,

 

For the spinning outfits, I found that the Albright or uni-knot will weaken after several casts, tinging through the guides and I have lost nice fish due to this.

 

I now use a spider hitch in the braid, with the loop created by the spider hitch I'll use the off shore swivel knot the the barrel swivel, and from there the leader material, usually 4 to 5 feet of Flouro.

 

I like the spider hitch because you can feel the small knot tick through the top guide before the swivel reaches the tip, this helps alot at night, it can be a real hassel reeling the barrel through the guides. biggrin.gif

 

------------------

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Dubs a.k.a., Charlie

dubs@stripersonline.com

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