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Peter Patricelli

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  1. Ok, OK........ Now let us get reel. If you wind the line onto your hand you are putting twist into the line with each turn. Just like a spinning reel. If you were to then point your fingers outward and pull the line off outward......you will UNwind the curl perfectly.......just like a spinning reel. If you wind the line onto a jar using the jar like a level wind spool.......no introduced curl. If you then point the jar outward and pull the line off parallel to the long axis (which is 90 degrees perpendicular to the direction in which it was wound on).......YOU WILL INTRODUCE TWIST WITHEACH CIRCLE OF THE LINE! And that is the line you will, now cast ......with curl. You would have to carefully turn the whole stack of line, rotating the whole stack carefully (if you didn't bring the jar with you and had carefully fitted the stack over it) so the line comes straight off the stack along the same axis it as it went on. Just like a level wind reel. Straight on....straight off. VERY (VERY) hard to do (and time consuming) out on the water. For a 30' head that would take me more than a minute. If it was wound onto my hand, I can just hold one end and throw the stack loose in about 2 seconds. IF I chose the correct side of the stack to hold onto and throw I would UNwind the curl perfectly....like a spinning reel. If I chose the wrond side of the stack to unwind, I would introduce MORE (double the) curl coming off! In real time, I just have a system. I always grab the same end.....in my case loop end....that I first held when I started winding. Then I lift it and watch the curl. If it's unwinding then I continue and throw the stack. If it is curling then I pass the loop thru the center of the stack and turn it over and pull (or throw)......unwinding it. But in reality, it is not THAT much of a big deal either way. Before someone popularized rotating the rod, the common sense method of UNcurling flyline that had twist in it was to let it all out and drag it behind the boat....or let it drag in river/stream current. It will UNcurl itself. Just casting the head and retrieving it will uncurl it. NOT a big deal either way.......IF you understand and execute the rod spinning maneuver when necessary. I have used 30' heads for 63 years, at time extensively and almost exclusively, and much of that with mono running line.....easily the most twisty and troublesome of running lines when twisted. And casting heads tends to introduce twist because (I at least usually) roll cast twice in each cast. And with a head the running line is usually MUCH smaller and lighter compared to the head than is a full line configuration....so the running line gathers twist and does not have the stiffness to transmit it back into the head to get untwisted on the retrieve. Twist in the line is trouble only when the twist is in the running line to wind up and jam ruining shoot. And twist in the running line tends to concentrate when using heads due to ones casting sequence and because the running line has such less stiffness. BUT......if one's running line is twisting, throw all the line onto the water (to specifically get the running line that is off the reel being used in casting tight to the reel) turn the rod perpendicular to your body with each hand looped loosely between your fingers, look at the direction of the curl (for me, right handed, it is coming over the top towards me) and SPIN the rod 4-5 times. Amazing how few spins it takes. And POOF! Twist is gone. Re-take rod by the handle and resume casting. Easy peasy. There are a zillion video examples demonstrating this on the internet. Sooooo.....as far as I am concerned, DON'T OVER THINK THIS! Reel carefully onto a bottle like a level-wind.....and on the water if you don't carefully unwind the loose stack the same way you will in fact introduce the curl you thought you had avoided. Use figure of 8 coiling.....OK......comes off straight but can be bulky. Or Just wind it onto your hand. Grab the same end to pull it out and get your orientation right and you will perfectly UNwind your introduced twist. OR......do it all wrong and double your twist? Start casting as usual. The twist is in your head......not your running line (I change heads with my loops outside of the rod guides so I don't have to re-string). Make a cast and the head will mostly untwist itself. Even if it doesn't your casting is likely to start introducing twist anyway, which when it becomes troublesome you correct with occasional rod spinning. 5 seconds.....gone. Over the years I played with all the variations and it was when I learned the rod spinning trick that I simply descended to the fastest, laziest, most simple and just went back to winding it onto my fingers. Fly fishing is, when looked at big picture, an over thunk, overcomplicated, needless complication to a very simple process. Catch fish? Use a net.....or dynamite. So, argue about how to wind up 30' of line? I guess it was inevitable and we deserve this.
  2. Try that roll'em up on a jar when you are waded up to your navel, holding your rod out of the water in one hand, and you have breaking fish in front of you. I have no problem with the figure 8 winding XCEPT that 3-4 heads rolled that way, stacked together in whatever, concentrates the thickness in one spot....the center......and it becomes a thick lump. I've never found the coiling of Fergal's method to be a problem. If you are roll casting in prep to the shoot you are coiling the line anyway, and I can get coils out of the running line in 10 seconds by spinning the rod (with all line out)......easy peasy. With a changed, coiled head all the coiling is in the head. One cast and retreive of the new head and 99% will straighten out on their own.
  3. Here are some attempts. You decide whether to emulate or do the opposite. http://www.flyfishingfotography.com/fishtales_new_022.htm
  4. Sun Valley (the city and area) has a LOT to see and do. The catch and release fishing water runs right through downtown Bellevue, and Silver Creek is a 20 minute drive. When you step out of your car you are within 30 feet of more trout than you can handle in a day......once you learn how to catch one. A float tube or similar device is more or less a must. I suspect you can rent one from one of the fly shops.....or get a guide as a starter.....and he/she would have one for you. Written 40 years ago: http://www.flyfishingfotography.com/fishtales_new_049.htm or the more gritty version: http://www.flyfishingfotography.com/fishtales_new_053.htm And yes, it was a "last chance".........and not enough of one.
  5. I am tempted to say....since I never found a way to have my cake and eat it too....when you are done with that trip, then take the similar route for the fishing. If I were to plan a route, the one site I would especially target would be the Sun valley, ID area. It has been decades since I was there, but Silver Creek still sings to me in my dreams.
  6. If wading, option #1 is beaching the fish in shallow water bu sliding it up far enough that it is on it's side and cannot turn. Then it is a relatively easy process of getting a grip on the jaw and de-hooking the fly, spinning the fish around and leading it to deeper water. The bigger problem is when one is wading in current out on a bar in waist deep water. The drag on even a tired big fish is huge and there is only one small area where the current is broken......and that is in the lee of your body. THIS is the situation where a really light rod and especially light leader is a BAD idea. A big fish will be planing back and forth and getting a shot at an open jaw is almost impossible. The first tricky maneuver is swinging the rod upcurrent far enough so that the trailing the line slides into you so that you can grab the leader butt. This is when a light rod can be broken. Then.....stash the rod under your armpit and handline the fish from that point, giving line when necessary and the pulling it back by the line into your eddy until you can grab the jaw. Again....light leader is going to be a huge problem doing that. Get the fish in close in your eddy and proceed from there with lip grab and de-hooking and releasing. Then....after maybe a minute or two, one can breathe again and let out a shout! Such a terrible problem to have! Again, (Bring enough boat) (bring enough anchor), bring enough rod, and bring enough leader.
  7. I have been there 6X. BUT.....the last trip was over 25 years ago and my understanding is that a lot has changed since then. It slowly occurred to me that I actually have a (very old) section of destination pictures and text from those "old days" on my old website. the pictures are small because THAT WAS THE MAX SIZE OF COMPUTER MONITOR SCREENS WHEN I FIRST PUT THIS SITE ON THE "NEW" WEB!' http://www.flyfishingfotography.com/chistmasisland_new_001.htm Since then rumor has it....the fishing further deteriorated until the government realized they were killing the cash cow (fishing tourism on Xmas Isl) that was supplying > 50% of the revenue for the whole country back then....and the indescriminate netting by the population was limited or stopped altogether in enough of the lagoon that the fishing rebounded and became good again. And, instead of the single, gov. owned residence/lodge (Captain Cook Hotel), at least 2 independent outfits began hosting and guiding fishermen. I would guess more than that now. And, I suspect, the boats used have been upgraded. Between the outer reef and the enormous (world's largest atoll) lagoon, there is sure room for them....as long as the killing is restricted. I have too many Xmas Isl, stories to tell. But some thoughts: 1) do NOT drag a huge chicken-like assemblage of feathers with a hook in it tied directly to your flyline behind the boat when leaving the dock with your group to go fishing in the morning because A) you may lose part or all of your flyline in a coral head (Giant Trevally) and B) you'll never get anywhere (lots of Giant Trevally). Ask me how I know. 2) do NOT be stupid enough to expose yourself to the sun at that longitude on the first day and be bed-ridden for the rest of the week....unable to fish.....as I saw one gentleman (who also qualified for time in an alcohol treatment center) do. 3) Start the week with brand new, UV resistant leader material...and change your leader butt (and tippet) at least every few days. On one trip late in the week I was off by myself when suddenly the entirety of my leader butt degraded to the point of uselessness. 40# stuff broke with the slightest pressure. I lost several hours of good fishing until I got back to my reserves. 4) Bring a thoughtful back up of medicines you might need. In the old days there was 1 (One)(ONE ONLY!) flight in and out A WEEK. On the flight from the mainland to Hawaii, the congestion from a dense head cold.....coupled with the depressurization-re-pressurization of takeoff and landing forced the mucus deep into my sinuses....repeated the second morning on the flight to Xmas Isl. Within 2 days I had a bad sinus infection which, by the third day was causing the entire area around my left eye to swell and throb. As a doctor I knew I was in trouble because by then there were only a few thin tissues between the abcess and my BRAIN.....which would be disasterous. I began to wonder what an emergency flight back to HI was going to cost me. Maybe there was some medical aid on the island, I never got that far. At dinner where ALL the week's fishermen population was assembled, I went to each table and inquired. Luckily there was another (more thoughtful) doctor in the group who had a prescription of a broad spectrum antibiotic which he gave me....and saved my trip....if not me. That place is a long way from ANYWHERE! My best Xmas Isl. memory was what happened in the first seconds of my first trip when I actually got to the water. After the flight we unpacked, grabbed rods, jumped into the back of the trucks, and even though late in the day, went out to the lagoon for a little introductory fishing. I was let out and the truck drove off to spot others. I walked out onto a shell-formed spit around which a strong current was flowing. Suddenly 7-8 very large bonefish in the 6# class BEACHED THEMSELVES AT MY FEET!! WTF!! Then I saw this big, tuna-shaped dark THING zing by me. My first thought was..... what the heck is a tuna doing inside the lagoon? Then it dawned on me. That must be a Giant Trevally (and thus the terrorized bonefish flopping in front of me). But......I was prepared......the drill told to us was to carry a popper in your breast pocket. These things appear and are gone in mere seconds. One was to put the hook of your bonefish fly....in this case a Charlie....thru the eye of the popper......and throw it! I did just that, got off a clumsy 40 foot cast ......and popped it. This black beast re-appeared and opened it's mouth coming from underneath....and I pulled the fly out before it could chomp. DAMN!! I flopped the popper out a second time. The beast appeared and ate the popper. And I set the hook.....simultaneous with the realization that.....since I had previously caught (small) bonefish in the caribbean....on 6# test.......and since i wanted to get one here quickly.......I still had on 6# test leader. Uh Oh! PING! I hardly even felt any resistance. The entire encounter was over in about 10 seconds. But all was not a total loss. A few seconds later I saw my popper come floating serenely back to the surface. The GT had simply held the popper firmly not allowing any movement to "set" the hook, decided it didn't taste edible.....and spit it out in contempt. Those 10 seconds were the totality of my GT experience on Xmas Isl. for several more trips....until....given a full 5 minutes from first spotting a pair of big GT's cruising toward me along an encircling shoreline....5 minutes to prepare.....I never even got a cast off. I had ascended the shoreline onto the coral shoulder to keep my stripped out line out of the water and free from debris as I cut back my leader and tied on a popper. When the GT's were a hundred feet and coming I prepared to cast......but my flyline was hopelessly glued at each contact point to the incredibly spiculated coral bedrock and each inch had to be hand loosened. I watched helplessly as the GT's ran into the assembled baitfish school I had been pushing ahead of me as I waded, crashed into them in 4-5 explosions.....and wandered off to execute mayhem elsewhere. About ten minutes later I had my line free and had to re-tie for bonefish. Some people are not meant to land a GT. That encounter was the last time I went without the....at that time.....novel thing called a stripping basket. These days, I hear that they chum them TO YOU....so you KNOW an are PREPARED with the appropriate rod/reel/leader/fly. Have fun. It is a trip!
  8. Gentlepeople, If you read mt first post on this thread, I mentioned a minor accident and some pain. That turned out to be 3 fractured and distracted ribs, active arterial bleeding into my left lung cavity, collapse of the left lung, eventual recognition that "there was something wrong", open chest surgery, 5 days in the ICU, and finally back home awaiting slow self replacement of a whole lot of lost blood, healing of the ribs, and general recovery. That is going to take about 4 weeks. Anyway....... 2 important facts that control my thinking about this market in general are: Modern synthetic rods are, if protected from stupidity, indestructible with an infinite lifespan. Unlike bamboo rods that did not tolerate moisture and/or dry-wet cycles, could be over-stressed without obvious fracturing, but "softened", etc., the modern rod after 30 years of daily hard use is exactly the same rod, minus perhaps some (easily replaceable) grooved guides, and possibly softened cork (replaceable). Once you have bought a modern synthetic rod that covers you need for your most common fishing situation.......YOU NO LONGER NEED ANOTHER ROD LIKE THAT.!! Gotta run...will continue.
  9. Mike, Actually I think we agree on about 98% of everything regarding casting. You said above (and many, many times in other threads) that money is better spent taking casting lessons than on expensive, over-marketed hyped rods......and we are, from different directions, saying the same thing. There are many, many rods out there with differing actions. At one extreme you have a caster with a rigid style and stroke, and from the spectrum of those rods there are those that will fit his/her style....at least better than others. So our rigid style caster spends money chasing the hype hoping the "expensive" rod is the secret solution to his casting stroke. At the other extreme you have someone who has learned the adjustments in stroke and timing and can rapidly fit him/herself to rod in his/her hand and as Tarponguide (from the old original Florida Flyfishing Forum) said 3 decades ago....."a good caster can cast with anything". And, after all, the rod is what it is, set, inert, rigid and stable in it's action. IT cannot adjust. It is the arm and shoulder sswinging the rod that must adjust. The good news these days is that there are no really BAD rods, just different ones, all of them being perfectly castable. In the beginning 60+ years ago I learned a LOT from some awful casting rods (some of them expensive bamboo-action-imitators-in fiberglass being made then) the likes of which simply no longer exist on the market.....at any price, Low end rods these days are eminently castable and better than many of the high end rods were 20 years ago. Once the mandrel are made, any rod ation can be knocked off in infinite numbers at a very low price. This is NOT hand-planing bamboo to a pre-set written formula. Since, about 10+ years ago when Cabelas discontinued and sold off their Three Forks line of low end rods....and I bought an anticipated lifetime supply of 9' 6, 8, 10, and 12 wts ......for $40-$50 each.... I have not dabbled with their current line so I cannot talk about what is currently available, but I would wager that the concept is still true. Flyrods as a market these days are like the automobile market (or watches). Some serve different use models better than others, some can draw ooohhs and AAwws as you drive by, some are more fun to drive than others (and in the watch analogy....some fit your shoe color better than others.....or make an income statement better than others) but they all will go 70 miles an hour (or just tell you what time it is). Parenthetically I would say that of all the rods way back then I forced myself to learn and adapt to the one that "taught" me the most in terms of casting, in stroke, timing, and 2 hand coordination) it is hands down the 4' Abercrombie and Fitch rod given to me as a present (I would never have bought it on my own) in my early 20's. Talk about forcing you to "ADJUST"! And I noted then....altho I consider them a gimmick/illusion rod now..... that Lee Wulff made a big deal out of using a 4' rod in his Atlantic Salmon fishing and Left Kreh in his casting demonstrations wowed them by throwing a whole line with the front half of a 9' rod (4 1/2 feet). I would never consider them as a beginners learning rod, but for the intermediate caster wanting the fastest path to the full arm-shoulder stroke and line-hand-arc-extending stroke of saltwater fly fishing......I would highly recommend them. It is the equivalent of throwing the non-swimmer into the water. You either free up your arm-shoulder-back and your timing, to become the half-rod butt that isn't there......or you sink. The 4' rod came with a special 60' weight forward line.....and I was eventually throwing ALL the line and another 15 feet of backing. It IS do-able. It IS fun to do.....for awhile. And, once you have learned the adjustments......you take off the "training wheels", so-to-speak, and can then, forever cast with anything. The 4' mid-weight (5-6) rods and the old, delaminated 10' bamboo rod from the turn of the century, discovered in the attic. WONDERFUL teaching tools!! Yup. To your advice of "spend the money on casting lessons, not on chasing secret, expensive rods that will "fix" your poor casting stroke".....advice I heartily endorse.....I would throw in to the recommendation bucket a couple of really weird casting "tools". They ALL work! YOU learn the adjustments!
  10. Reading this eating popcorn. Haven't spent more than $60 on a fly rod in the past 10 years. And if we move the needle to $150, not in the past 30 years. Has not affected my fishing success or fun in the slightest. It HAS increased the fun and success I have with other things I spend the money on. Lots of nice rods out there out of my "price range". Some I "like" better....but not enough to justify the exorbitant cost. Back when high end rods were in the $300-400 range, the newest space age nano-titanium blanks cost $5-10 to make. Does anyone think the highest end blank these days costs more than $35 to make? I don't know....and the manufacturer will never tell you. But I doubt it. Sorry, I can't continue right now with what I want to sat due to pain from a recent accident. Nothing very serious, but raw and painful. When I can I will continue.
  11. Unusual looking carp. Might be a hybrid or a different species altogether. Huge scale pattern and a longer head, extended snout. Looks nothing like the common carp around here. Sight fishing our carp here very difficult. They are sensitive, touchy, and very wary. Also, they can take a fly and eject it faster than any fish I have ever caught. You have to see the mouth suck ands tighten instantly or you will miss them. How hard.....or easy.....I suspect depends on the waters and what they are feeding on. Never caught one here on anything other than a small nymph....like a hare's ear. And light tippets demanded. Interesting rod. Some new space age material?
  12. Mike, I suspect from previous conversations that I understand where you were and what you experienced. I also understand, after running into you, still in your full wetsuit, stumbling out of a visit to the G**se ******* shop, mumbling from sleep deprivation, how badly you are capable of burning the candle at both ends. Perhaps, just perhaps, welcome to some early signs of sanity. Age, and diminishing energy levels can do that with "maturity". Been there for years. For decades now I find 4-6 hours to be a nice compromise. If the fishing is poor then I'm getting bored, losing interest, mind wandering, doing more bird watching than fishing....in my head anyway. Time to solidify the inevitable high moments of those hours, even if they have nothing to do with fish or fishing, and do something else. And, just as often, if the fishing is good or spectacular, after some single digit hours, I'm getting bored. I'm thinking to myserlf..... ho hum, another 30" striper.....just like the last one......and the one before it. I've got nothing to prove. Time to take a break and savor the wonderment of the day so I will remember it forever, not ruin it with the exhaustion or numbness that comes with pursuit of some vague, silly numbers game. And, in keeping with this train of thought, a few years back I was out on Biscayne Bay with a friend in the boat of a guide I had not met before. My friend had warned me that this particular guide had a tendency to want to stay out all day because of conflict at home and he was staying in the relationship because of his young daughter. We were chasing bones. Joel had caught one....Biscayne Bay bones are always memorable since they are all close to or over single digits..... but otherwise was slow. Beautiful day, beautiful water, interesting conversation, learned lots as this guide made his well learned rounds through water I knew well and fished, my less experienced way, daily. At dead low tide, late afternoon, we had been in the boat about 10 hours, and we were within sight of Black Point marina., from which we had launched. The guide suddenly, possibly because he had thought of what he might face at home, suggested we run 10 miles in the opposite direction to check out some spot that would, when we got there be, into the early incoming, might be bones....whaddaya say? I was tired, bored, dehydrated, and maybe a little sunburned. I had had a great day. Even if I were to catch a 12# bone.....been there....done that. My memories of the day could only go downhill. And I had no reason to be part of this man's marital problems. Joel had warned me that this might happen so I knew how he felt. So I said: "You know, John, I've found that for me, fishing is a lot like group sex. In the long run. after so many hours, you've only got so much to give, your mind begins to wander and you start wondering..... what's on television? I think I've had enough." The guide got this glassy look in his eye, his jaw slack, mouth open. We were in Miami, after all. "Du.....do.......do you belong to one of those ...ss....sss....sex clubs??" I just smiled and shrugged. "I'm just saying......we've had a great day. It's hard to improve on that. Let's take it to the ramp and put it to bed." And, with the guide's head spinning with a whole new train of thought.....we did. Guess what I remember the most about that day.
  13. These days, I believe virtually ALL flylines over 7wt have a breaking strength of 30# or more. I use 20# tippets all the time. No one I have ever fished with considers 20# a sufficient "bite guard" for blues, sharks, snook, cudas, mackerel, or tarpon. The rare times I have caught a snook when fishing bones or redfish with regular 15-20# the leader is seriously abraided....and that is obviously only the ones I landed. Every guide I have fished with for snook has tied on either a 30# or 40# segment of bite guard to my tapered leaders......and then carefully checked it after each caught fish.....and often retie a new one. I wrote what I wrote because at least three of the initial respondents (previously ) mentioned the issue....without quite the detail. I am aware of those who will tie a single, level 30 or 40# and let it go at that, and THAT is what the op was questioning. These threads are read by many more than ever respond here, often on the lower end of the learning curve. I thought the discussion should be balanced so those could hear from both schools of thought. In the long run you pays your money and takes your chances.
  14. "Ok how many guys on Sol have lost a fly line when their backing ran out on a fish. Are we protecting against the most unlikely?" Mike, I never mentioned getting spooled. Never lost a line being spooled. Never been spooled. But I have hooked things that got into my backing that WOULD have spooled me had I not clamped down on the reel to break it off......such as a fish going around a trolling boat going the other direction, a big shark.....and an alligator. Or....a tail-hooked fish going the other direction I couldn't or didn't want to chase or waste time on. Clamp down, lose the fly (if the proper fuse is in the system) and get on with it. And I have hooked, from shore, big fish that went way out there and got around on a rock, piling, lobster pot, and on and on. If you have never had to break off pulling on your backing....then you ought to get out more. Breaking off pulling on your backing is always a nail-biter. You are only going to get your whole flyline back if it is NOT the flyline itself that is tangled. But if it is the line that is snagged, I want to be able to pull right up to the breaking strength of the flyline in an attempt to free it....not being limited by a weaker backing. Obviously where and what you fish for moderates your risk for these misadventures. Back when I was going to Xmas Isl and facing the GT's I remember a famous flyfishing personality (blocking on the name at this moment) who went to Midway for GT's when they first opened it up to the public and in the first few days lost ALL of his flylines. Maybe I just dream or fantasize bigger than you do. Nothing solves all problems, but one can increase or decrease your risk. I fish these days in the NW (where even a fair hooked or snagged sturgeon is a possibility), Florida, San Diego and Baja, and Cape Cod. I set my reels up in such a way that I really only have to deal with keeping my leader weaker (somewhere) than my fly line. The rest is up to the fish gods.
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