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Braid for ulta light techniques

post #1 of 48
Thread Starter 
InFisherman had an interesting article on using very light braid line for fishing small and light lures for smallmouths on long casts.

I have been experimenting with 5 and 6 lb braid for trout and bass fishing, but have run into some challenges with line twist and the line cutting into the spool due to the fact that line that was not wound tightly on the spool due to casting and retrieving light lures.

I was wondering what your experience is and what light braid lines you would recommend. I tried PowerPro and while it casts great I had problems with line twist. I tried FireLine and while it handled better it did not cast as well.

I look forward to you help and advice.
Edited by Jay Blair - 5/12/12 at 12:46pm
post #2 of 48
I have been using 15lb power pro on my spinning setups for smallies for the past two years and I would NEVER go back to mono. When bottom bouncing light baits on 1/16 and 1/8oz jigheads while the boat is drifting or its windy out, you need the feel you get from braid because with mono and a bow in your line you will not feel those lighter pickups. Also if your fishing deeper water or making long casts you will want that quicker hookset. I usually just use 10lb mono for a leader; don't go lighter because I am usually fishing around a bunch of rocks.
post #3 of 48
Thread Starter 
Thanks Skunkmaster,

I did the exact same thing with 15Lb PowerPro and Super Flukes for smallies this Spring to great effect- see April Report, however I have been having challenges with the lighter stuff and that is where I need help.

Maybe 832 Suffix or Nanofil would work better, but it is good to hear from folks who have experience working with it.
Edited by Jay Blair - 5/11/12 at 10:00am
post #4 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skunkmaster flex View Post

I have been using 15lb power pro on my spinning setups for smallies for the past two years and I would NEVER go back to mono. When bottom bouncing light baits on 1/16 and 1/8oz jigheads while the boat is drifting or its windy out, you need the feel you get from braid because with mono and a bow in your line you will not feel those lighter pickups. Also if your fishing deeper water or making long casts you will want that quicker hookset. I usually just use 10lb mono for a leader; don't go lighter because I am usually fishing around a bunch of rocks.
what he said except i rarely (for now) fish from a boat. my smallie fishing is in a river and the benefits far outweigh the downsides imo. 15lb braid with a 10lb leader in a river throwing sticks, cranks and buzzbaits are perfect for me. 10lb braid and 8 or even 6lb leader with light jigs also is ideal for me. being able to distinguish the subtle difference in a light pick up or a tick of the bottom is not something i was able to differentiate between with mono. of course when they hit it with authority there is no questioning but those subtle pickups are teh ones i feel make fishing with braid worthwhile and increase my hook ups.
post #5 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Blair View Post

Thanks Skunkmaster,
I did the exact same thing with 15Lb PowerPro and Super Flukes for smallies this Spring to great effect- see April Report, however I have been having challenges with the lighter stuff and that is where I need help.
Maybe 832 Suffix or Nanofil would work better, but it is good to hear from folks who have experience working with it.
I haven't had any problems with line twist or it cutting into the spool. I would take it all off the spool and then tie it to something stationary(car bumper) and then reel it in under pressuer so that it gets packed down tight. Or you could cast it behind the boat with a heavier lure and reel it in under pressure. I also honestly think that just some reels are no good with braid, they just don't do a good job at laying the line back onto the reel evenly, some people will probably disagree. Is the line brand new? You may also just need to get some more hours on the line and it will be friendlier to you.
post #6 of 48
I'm a big fan of the float N fly technique, and started using 15 lb PP braid several years ago. I'll use this method year round too. I agree with these guys, I'll never go back to mono. I won't go lighter than 15 lb either. Tried some 10 lb once & had way too many problems, like the line digging in. 15 is plenty small enough. The sensitivity with braid makes it worth using IMO. Keeping the line tight on the spool is a problem sometimes, and that stuff with cut you like a razor if you're not careful with it!

I have also tried the Sufix 832 braid in heavier test, and like it better than PP, so I'll be trying the 15 lb too. I don't usually use a leader, only because I haven't found it necessary to catch fish, and in the places I fish most abrasion is not often a problem. I would use a leader solely for abrasion issues, and would probably use Yozuri Hybrid, because I already use it, and it has good abrasion resistance. I use in heavier tests on some baitcasters & the lighter tests to make fly rod leaders too.

With the FNF technique, my rods are very long, one is a 12' noodle rod, and the other is a BPS 8'6" FNF rod. Both will cast light lures a long way's, and the 12'' rod is great in close just because of it's longer reach. I use the method for panfish as well as for bass.

Otherwise, I now only use Ande or Silver Thread mono lines on some other spinning rods, light & ultra light that I use for panfish & primarily because I've used both for a long time with great results, and they're just cheaper than braids. These are my "just for fun, just want to be out there" fishing rods, where I don't really care if I catch anything or not.

I'm a bit more serious when using the braid. smile.gif
post #7 of 48
Good topic, I have been in trouble for light braid (4#) for a couple years also. The worst part is outlayer line cut into deeper spool, changing reels did not help. Is it a good idea to use that light braid? Momo/fluoro maybe the way to go.
post #8 of 48
I understand the need/want/distance of a light/thin line, but at what point do the benefits start to fall. In other words, if i can cast 30% further with 10lb pp than 30 lb pp how much further would i be able to cast with 4lb pp than 10 lb pp?

edit: I also understand that its less visible, but that also is a slim difference i diameter between 10 lb and 6 lb?
post #9 of 48
another issue for me at least is the fact that 20 lb braid is easily cut up on rocks / snags so how frail (wrt abrasion) would 10 lb braid be ? wont using mono of say 6-8 lbs give you better abrasion resistance ? casting though will be an issue but as a poster said above 10 % may not be so great. nothing below 20 lb tuffline for me !
post #10 of 48
I use 10# Sufix 832 for all my light tackle fresh water fishing. Excellent line.
post #11 of 48
Quote:
I understand the need/want/distance of a light/thin line, but at what point do the benefits start to fall. In other words, if i can cast 30% further with 10lb pp than 30 lb pp how much further would i be able to cast with 4lb pp than 10 lb pp?

edit: I also understand that its less visible, but that also is a slim difference i diameter between 10 lb and 6 lb?

That's a very good point. For whatever reason, it seems to me some folks go to very light braid when there really is no need for it. But, I guess the same could be true on the heavy end too. There is a difference between using 4 lb mono & the equivalent diameter braid. Mono being more buoyant than braid, particularly with very light lures will fall at a different rate than braid. Although I'm not sure it would be that much difference in shallow water, it could possibly be an issue in deep situations. However, if you're fishing in 10-12 ft or less, and not needing to make extremely long casts, what advantage does it really give you over using a heavier line, particularly when abrasion with braid is not that good to begin with.

For me, I'm fishing in relatively shallow rivers & creeks, and frankly don't have the need to make extremely long casts. These creeks are narrow enough in spots I can cast from one side to the other. On some types of water, long casts may be necessary, but as you say, once you get way down in size with the braid, does the small difference in size give you that much more distance? Even if it does, is it really needed? When I tried the 10lb PP, the problems I had with it were not worth any distance gains I may get over using the 15 lb. Since then, and because the 15 has worked fine, I'm reluctant to try anything lighter, and really have no need to. As far as visibility of the line goes, opinions vary on that subject, I don't feel it's an issue. I flip & pitch jigs with 50 & 65 lb. hi vis yellow, tie direct to the jigs I still catch plenty of fish. I don't believe the fish are that smart to know what that line is, or associate it with anything dangerous to them. That same mindset could also be applied to the exposed hooks & again I don't feel it's a problem either. smile.gif
post #12 of 48
Can I throw a monkey at your Wrench.......smile.gif

I have braid on everything I own.....And when it comes to the ultralight stuff....Truly like using fireline......And now after a few dozen quality fish, and a few thousand casts am transitioning to fireline......

For the light stuff regardless if you like how it handles....It does perform better than any light braid I've tried.....And the Nanofil stuff really is a real step up....Its knot strength isn't really up to snuff with fireline...which would mean in reality its not thinner.....But for casting distance and speed (i like a big splash down with wacky rigged baits) There is no line that is even close.

One major plus is since braid floats even with high end rods, the Nanofil is noticeably more sensitive on slack line bites than with 2lb diameter power pro, suffix and og fireline.

And with ultralight braids when doing line to line joins......I'm getting stronger knots when using chapstick vs saliva when cinching them down.tight. Which is very important when using the light stuff.
post #13 of 48
I use 10# PP on my trout rods with an 18 inch 8# fluro leader and most times I am throwing small spinners, a tiny ice jig or just a plain hook with a BB size splitshot.


I can cast a mile, no problems with line cutting into the spool, wind knots or mysterious break offs. I've used it to toss bass baits too, and with more weight I obviously can get more distance but no problems there either.


Never tried anything lighter, not sure I really need to.
post #14 of 48
Thread Starter 
Hmmm, Lets see if I can summarize. I guess most of us agree that the heavier braids; 15 lb. and up are much easier to handle and some of us use leaders and some do not. Some feel that they need a leader to help protect the braid and make it steathier and I think it really depends on your fishing techniques and where and what you are fishing for. It is a matter of preference and confidence . I can't see not using a fluoro leader fishing 1/32oz. jigs for trout in gin clear water. Not only do you get more bites, but it helps improve the sink rate for tiny jigs. From what you guys are saying it also sounds like some of you are comfortable with 10 lb. and it is pretty versatle stuff for a lot of light tackle fishing situation and you don't think there is a need to go any lighter and from what I have experienced I would agree to some extent. It is light, but not so light that it is difficult to handle and fish with, however there are some of us who want to cast small lighter lures further to fool older and more wary fish. New lines like Nanofil and 832 are going to create new opportunities for different fishing applications and tackle manufacturers are coming out with reels like the Stradic CI, longer lighter rods, and thinner stonger hooks to use these new lighter and stronger braids. My frustration is that these light braids are finicky and require new knots, tackle, and techniques, and there is a definite learning curve involved. While Nanofil probably holds the greatest promise and casting advantages I can't see tying a double uni knot in the wind at stream side with stuff that handles like super slick silk thread. Maybe I am getting older, but this is a whole different game than mono or fluoro.

Please keep the comments going. I think these new lighter braids hold promise for longer casts with lighter lures for fooling older bigger fish with good hooksets at distances we only used to dream of.

Once you catch a truly big fish and feel what it is like to fight it on this light stuff it is addictive. If you fish side by side with someone that is using traditional techniques and you out fish them 5 to one it is also addictive. Then you get a wind knot, or a break off because your knot failed, or your line cuts into the spool on a big fish and you break them off and you are left frustrated.

Now if I can just manage to tie those new knots in silk treads like a spider and get the line to play nice I will be all set.
Edited by Jay Blair - 5/12/12 at 11:02am
post #15 of 48
Try daiwa samurai braid 15lb equivalent diameter (lb. test) 2.5 lb.Great braid. Very easy to cast on a bait casting or spinning reel. Its super smooth and super tough. In my opinion its better than PowerPro. Remember, you always get what you pay for. wink.gif
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