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what do you think of that new cesspool law?

post #1 of 33
Thread Starter 
http://www.projo.com/news/content/CE...9.1a1aea3.html


great idea but the timeframe seems a little short...doesnt seem fair, nor does it address the municipal plant overflow, which is the bigger issue.
post #2 of 33
I remember this being rolled out back in 2007 and I am not anywhere near the water. I would be surprised if people with these systems didn't know of the coming law change. They can push out to 2018 if they can prove hardship. You're probably going to see a lot of people applying for equity loans to finance the systems. If I had to guess, as the movement gains momentum, there will probably be state backed grants or low interest loans to help people fix their systems.
post #3 of 33
Thread Starter 
id be interested in the specifics of the hardship clause as well....just seems that the MA precedent of it being fixed when the house is sold, would have been a good way to do it...like i said the real issue isnt homes, its, among other things, the municipal plants overflowing every time we get a good rain...if my understanding of the issue is correct...
post #4 of 33
In MA its called Title V and even though its for the "common good", its generally a big PITA if the seller doesn't have the means to pay for it.
Its even more of a mess if the property is foreclosed on and has a failed septic because most lenders won't finance a property without Title V certification. It appears to me that they are starting small with high impact areas since they are hard to argue against but this is the camel's nose under the tent. Soon the state will follow in the footsteps of MA and force it upon all cesspools and then start septic system testing.
I just re-read the article and it states that a local agency already offers 2% loans for septic systems in affected areas.
post #5 of 33
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Choggie View Post
In MA its called Title V and even though its for the "common good", its generally a big PITA if the seller doesn't have the means to pay for it.
Its even more of a mess if the property is foreclosed on and has a failed septic because most lenders won't finance a property without Title V certification. It appears to me that they are starting small with high impact areas since they are hard to argue against but this is the camel's nose under the tent. Soon the state will follow in the footsteps of MA and force it upon all cesspools and then start septic system testing.
I just re-read the article and it states that a local agency already offers 2% loans for septic systems in affected areas.

I understand your larger point..when I moved out here we looked at more houses in MA than RI..if I remember correctly, the work could be settled into the buying price of the house, no? this is obviously in regard (more) to the forecloser point...
post #6 of 33
A person that buys waterfront property(within 200 ft.) should be able to afford the cost of a new system.
post #7 of 33
Thread Starter 
i qualify (200 rule) and I live in the upper bay.....and know a lot of people who do too, and are far from "rich"
post #8 of 33
I live right on the fringe of the 200 ft zone...it's going to be close.

And should I happen to fall within the effected limits it will get real interesting . In order to get the earth removal equipment and septic unit to the site, either part of my home or neighbors matured trees will have to go .....or I guess they could compel to dig up my new drive way ?
post #9 of 33
Clearly, in some areas (Narrow River or Green Hill Pond, for example) these individual systems have destroyed habitats.

Does the Rhode Island plan have a public financing option?

In number of states, owners can apply for and receive a loan from a public authority or from bank with public guarantee (like a student loan) for system replacement. Typical repyment period is 10 yers with a due on sale clause if the property is sold before the loan is repaid.
post #10 of 33
If they can prove they have a hardship, they can get the deadline pushed back to 2018. They should also make interest free loans available to the homeowner.

Trigger's right
post #11 of 33
I'm close to the water also - just glad we're tied into the city sewer system. I can see why they would want it done in the next 2 years, but damn, couldn't they have done this when house prices were higher so people could actually get the HEL?
post #12 of 33
Sorry - I GOTTA come outta the woodwork on this one....

Uhhhhh...Where's the data that proves that it is the cesspools that are to blame??? How to they PROVE the source? (if there is actual contamination...)
Or is this just another bunch of bullschit hippie-hype?

I live in a town rich in history and pre-revolutionary war houses...houses that have cess pools and dug wells. The drinking water, drawn from the same property that house the cesspools, is more pure than the fa66oty bottled water these lawmakers slurp down during these brainstorming sessions. When properly maintained and monitored, cesspools are just as effective as any other waste management system. Period....

If there is actual proof that a failed system caused a problem, then inspection and monitoring are the first lines of defense - Make those with failing systems mitigate the risk - NOT broad-stroke dictating on how people are required to spend their money.

Damn-to-hell the stupid-ass meddling special interest groups with human-hate agendas, damn the government agencies that fargin' listen and bend to their whim, and damn the sheep that posture submissively and accept what these legislative barnstormers puke all over them without a good old Yankee FIGHT!!!

I hate SHEEP.
post #13 of 33
Don't know anything about northeastern Connecticut, but the Rhode Island thing appears to have a sound scientific basis.

See, for example, http://www.crmc.ri.gov/samp_sp/Nitrogen_White_Paper.pdf:

Within about 15 years of the first URI salt pond study, concerns of
deteriorating conditions in the lagoons caused the RI CRMC, RI Sea Grant, RI
Statewide Planning, US EPA, and the towns of South Kingstown and Narragansett to
fund a second multidisciplinary ecosystem study by scientists at URI. This work
documented symptoms of eutrophication (an increase in the supply of organic matter
to an ecosystem; Nixon 1995), especially large quantities of macroalgae (Thorn-Miller
et al. 1983). It also identified septic systems as the major source of nitrogen entering
most of the salt ponds (Nixon et al. 1982, Lee and Olsen 1985). To be sure, lawn and
garden fertilizer, pet waste, and atmospheric deposition also contribute nitrogen to the
salt ponds, but human waste is by far the dominant source for the larger ponds. In their
study of nitrogen inputs to Pt. Judith, Potter, Cards, Trustom, Green Hill, and Ninigret
Ponds, Nixon et al. (1982) estimated that 70 to 95% of the nitrogen entering from land
and atmosphere came from ground water. A more recent assessment by Ernst (1996)
found that residential septic systems provided the following fractions of the nitrogen
input to the groundwater:

Pt. Judith 85% Potter 80%
Cards 45% Trustom 35%

Green Hill 90% Ninigret 60%
post #14 of 33
I'm up to my ears in this process right now trying to get an addition approved for our beach house in Westerly. Pretty much everything there south of Shore Rd. (Rt. 1A) in the "critical resource" area due to the salt pond.
As it stands today, any building alterations will need to be approved by the DEM prior to applying for a local building permit. This is their ticket to inspect and ultimately condemn the existing on-site waste water systems unless it consists of the new nitrate treatment components. Needless to say I am installing a new system even though my existing septic tank and cesspool leech pit is absolutely sound. If I refused, no building permit will issue. The ProJo article indicating a 10 to 15K price tag on the new style nitrate systems is a bit shy. I have heard of folks spending 30K++ depending on their soil make-up and system size.
One can only assume that the next government step in this regard will be mandatory statewide system inspections & subsequent condemnations of properties not in compliance within the critical resource boundaries which can be viewed at the DEM website. I believe there was a recent substantial hoorah in Charlestown over this issue. Gov. mandate with no funding.
post #15 of 33
I'm with Trigger. I've been an owner of property midway between Trustom Pond and Green Hill Pond since 1957 and seepage from the cesspools in all the small cottages around the two ponds has pretty much wiped everything out. Hell, you can smell it... but it is getting better because of the rules about updating systems in new builds and existing cottages/homes. Back in the day when these places were used by one familt on weekends... pre 1960 at least... it was not as bad. But when property values started going through the roof, folks were buying places and keeping them rented (usually to a bunch of adults and kids) all summer, cesspools overflowed and got a type of use they were not used to or built for. So into the ponds and off went the blue crabs. Bye bye.
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