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2 stroke vs 4 stroke

post #1 of 51
Thread Starter 
I apologize if this has been beaten to death before- however with a new boat being considered soon there seems to be a difference of opinion regarding 4 strokes vs 2 strokes. After having numerous discussions with marinas, mechanics and boaters themselves I think I have come to the conclusion of going with a 2 stroke. Of course the particulars for such as decision would be as follows; 90 to 150 hsp, probably settling in for a 115-135 on a 17-18 foot center console, vee hull.

I have been told that;

1) 4stroke is quieter at idle and wide open, is cleaner burning, much better gas mileage & has a better resale for your boat compared to the same boat with a 2 stroke.
Draw backs: more expensive, more moving parts, more oil and can be tougher to work on.

Generally the people that like 4 strokes are the consumers and specifically Yamaha/honda bigots.

The people I have found that like 2 strokes have been mechanics, consumers that have owned boats for quiet sometime and sold boats for a time. Yet others that just don't feel one way or the other and have not been convinced of 4 strokes.

I have been told that 2 strokes;
Are a just a hair louder at idle and wide open is subjective to a few decibels, just as clean or in some cases cleaner (evinrude & mercury) than 4 strokes. 2 stroke Gas mileage is better at high end. Torque and get up and go power is superior with a 2 stroke. 2 stokes have almost 1/2 the moving parts. 2 Strokes can be 1500 to 2000 dollars less than a four stroke in the 100-150 hsp. 2 strokes can be 60 to 100 lbs lighter a 4 stroke in those same sizes.

I think I am leaning towards a 2 stroke. Possible Evinrude e-tec primarily because there seems to be plenty of evinrude dealers around for support/service-unlike Suzuki for example.

If you want to see something go to the etec challenge on the evinrude web site- <Commercial link removed>
Of particular interest is the "tug of war" and the "drag race"

What are your thoughts on 4 stroke versus 2 stroke?
post #2 of 51
4 strokes do have a worse hole shot, weigh more and have more parts as mentioned.

But, they are definately more quiet, have less gas consumption, no mixing or burning oil, no fouled plugs.

I can't work on 2 or 4 strokes so that does not matter to me anyway. I did find it pretty easy to change my oil, lower unit fluid, oil filter and oil the cyllinders this past fall.

I think part of the reason old school boaters and mechanics like two strokes is because they are, well... old school. Fear of the unknown can be a strong influence.

Personally I don't think I will ever go back to a two stroke.

D
post #3 of 51
Mercury Optimax is the most fuel efficient motor available. No debate. end of story. If you have other criteria, other engines may be more attractive. I have owned them all and don't favor one over the other but facts are facts.
post #4 of 51
A few years ago, Bass and Walleye Boats Magazine did a shootout of the following 90hp motors: E-tec, Honda, Suzuki, Merc optimax, and Tohatsu. (I guess Yamaha didn't want to enter a motor.) As far as fuel efficiency goes, Tohatsu's TLDI was the most fuel efficient of the bunch, 2 or 4 stroke.

http://www.bwbmag.com/output.cfm?id=943183
post #5 of 51
yamaha 4 strokes are very quiet yes they are more expensive but the fuel rang you you get they will pay for the selves in a season or 2
post #6 of 51
A 2 stroke will run circles around any 4 stroke of the same horsepower. There is no comparison in performance. 4 strokes are slow compared to 2 strokes. They do not have the hole shot or top end of a 2 stroke. They also do not rev as high. Everytime the piston goes down on a 2 stroke, it is a power stroke. A 4 stroke simply cannot compete with that kind of efficiency.
post #7 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimshady View Post
yamaha 4 strokes are very quiet yes they are more expensive but the fuel rang you you get they will pay for the selves in a season or 2


Look around at the individual tests regarding fuel efficency, the difference that you referenced between a 4 and 2 stroke........that may have been the case a few years ago- , today it's almost insignificant in some brands and models.
post #8 of 51
I do not think you can make a bad choice today. Most companies are making good engines today. There was a time I would NEVER put a black engine on my boat. Not today........Optimax is a great engine. E-Tec (I am not sure of yet). Some guys love them but I think I would probably buy an Optimax over an E-Tec (just for reliability purposes.....E-Tec needs another year or two of hardocre cunsumer use to convince me). Mercury had their problems w/Optimax and has since worked them out. I WOULD NEVER BUY ANOTHER YAMAHA HPDI AGAIN. Ohhh...I am a BIG Yamaha fan!!!! Just get their 4-strokes.......My buddies all have Suzuki 4 strokes and they are great! Reliable engines w/few issues. I am now fishing a 4-stroke Honda. Excellent engine too. Love it. Downside to these Suzuki's and Honda's is finding servicing dealers. You may need to travel some....If you have one close by then there are no problems. It seems like everyone services mercs and yamis.

My bottom line......if you keep this engine for many many years and are not the type to buy a boat and then 3 years later upgrade to a bigger or more high end craft then you will be happy with most engines today. BUT if you sell this rig in under 5 years............BUY A 4-STROKE!!! Otherwise you will get hammered on resale as well as it will take you longer to sell your rig........no question about it. The consumer has spoken loud and clear. They want 4 strokes. This is especially true if you are buying any outboard that is 115 HP or bigger.

HC
post #9 of 51
I was going to get a 4 stroke 90 for my 17ft Montauk,but because of the 90lbs weight difference went with a Yamie 2stroke, It's just fine and unless you use it everyday the fuel vs price difference doesn't come into play. I am intrigued by the E-tec engines I must say.
post #10 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by HCowen View Post
E-Tec needs another year or two of hardocre cunsumer use to convince me). Mercury had their problems w/Optimax and has since worked them out.
HC


E-TEC has been out and available for over 5 years now. That is not long enough to convince you?
I'll add, Evinrude has had the most successful introduction for a new outboard ever. There have been fewer reported problems with this motor and technology than any other previously introduced outboard motor.
The concerns of it being new and untested are outdated. It has proved itself already.

As for your initial comment, I agree wholeheartedly. Each manufacturer is putting out a great product and you will be satisfied no matter what you decide upon. At the moment Yamaha and Merc 2-strokes are the most cost effective purchases you can make.
However, fuel economy is no where near as good. AND, I would never go back to smelling that exhaust or listening to an older outboard ever again.

E-TEC and 4-strokes are the future.
post #11 of 51
BTW.... I own a 150 E-TEC....

Neck snapping hole-shot like I have never experienced. Anyone want a demo, let me know and I'll work it out for you. Simply amazing.
post #12 of 51
I like to take ya up on thet demo ....during striper season of course
post #13 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayR View Post
E-TEC has been out and available for over 5 years now. That is not long enough to convince you?
I'll add, Evinrude has had the most successful introduction for a new outboard ever. There have been fewer reported problems with this motor and technology than any other previously introduced outboard motor.
The concerns of it being new and untested are outdated. It has proved itself already.

As for your initial comment, I agree wholeheartedly. Each manufacturer is putting out a great product and you will be satisfied no matter what you decide upon. At the moment Yamaha and Merc 2-strokes are the most cost effective purchases you can make.
However, fuel economy is no where near as good. AND, I would never go back to smelling that exhaust or listening to an older outboard ever again.

E-TEC and 4-strokes are the future.


GO With YAMAHA... Trust me on this. E-TEC'S (Whole Shot Stinks) Have many problems. I fish in Pro-AM Tournaments and a friend of mine blew 3 powerheads on 3 different E-TEC'S in 2 years. Not to mention the amount of breakdowns I have seen with then in the last few years. The water intake holes are way too small and the only things I will say good about those thing is that they are quiet and good with gas.

Yamaha 4 Stroke Saltwater Series #1 on the water. ( I run a Yamaha 200 HPDI and on a 20' Skeeter and Max out at an impresive 73 MPH)
2nd Choice would be Mercury Opti
post #14 of 51
I confess. I'm a "Honda bigot". Not because of choice, but because I bought the boat used with a 150 four stroke. Its quiet, smokeless, fuel efficient and has run flawlessly for 400 hours. We'll see what next season brings.
post #15 of 51
JayR,

The reason I am not convinced about Etec is exactly the same reason Rustyjigz mentions. Here in Atlanta there are too many guys complaining of blown powerheads on these engines. NOW..........I will admit that these are almost ALL bass guys that run at 2 speeds....idle and open throttle. How can that possibly be good on an engine? On the other hand, many of these bassholes, I mean bass fishermen, are running Optimax w/o having the same problems. I just have heard too many bad stories on the Etec. My dealer in Atlanta is a Ranger dealer. He can sell me Suzuki, Etec, Mercury or Yamaha w/o feeling pressured by the boat MFG (since Ranger remains independent). He still pushes Yamaha on the 4-strokes and Mercury on the 2-strokes. Plain and simple he says they are the best............BUT HE WILL RIG WHATEVER YOU WANT HANGING ON THE REAR. I chose to hang a Honda for differnet reasons. It seems to me that in the outboard business owner recommendations go a long way in helping make a reputation. Optimax took it on the chin for a number of years and now looks very favorably to many 2 stroke buyers. Etec just ain't there yet......their technology seems awesome but the reliability factor has just not touched the public the way it needs to. Good thing they offer the longest warranty in the business. That should help some. You also hear that Bombardier is not doing so well financially.....Is that true? I do not know....I hear it from marine dealers who are concerned to take on more product. Are these rumors? Why don't we hear that about Suzucki or Yamaha? Something just smells funny. Although I am glad you have a great engine that is trouble free. My old 250 Yamaha HPDI (2004) blew 2 powerheads in 400 hours. I had less then 50 hours over 4000 RPM's. According to Yamaha master tech who came to look at the engine they said this engine was kept and run "to the book". Now I am scared of these direct injection, high output mega blocks.....I am sticking w/4-strokes unless I need a 90HP or smaller.
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