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ODM Frontier or Blackhole nano surf?

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QHNM

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12 mins ago, TimS said:

That's not a real 'warranty' program...it's above and beyond. Accidents aren't warranty failure...maybe these companies are the reason so many people today think slamming their rod in the door or high sticking a little bass in the surf til the rod tip folds is a 'warranty' issue? 

 

Equipment abuse, misuse and accidents have never been considered the same kinda problem as a manufacturing/material defect covered under warranty :idea:

 

TimS

Well, it is in conjunction with their 'real' warranty program (whether it be 5 yr, lifetime, etc.) from manufacturing defects. You are correct, it is above and beyond...and it's nice that as a company they offer it to their customers. 

 

 

11 mins ago, ksong said:

That is why I said the St Croix warranty is lucrative. I wonder how long the warranty lasts.

We want our anglers who appreciate our rods. We are kind of custom rod makers for small audience. 

 

Hopefully it lasts as long as it can...it's a nice perk provided by them to their customers. I hope to try a Black Hole rod someday as well...from what I've read, they seem to be of excellent quality.

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1 min ago, Romer Treece said:

 

 

 

Hopefully it lasts as long as it can...it's a nice perk provided by them to their customers. I hope to try a Black Hole rod someday as well...from what I've read, they seem to be of excellent quality.

I am testing hard beyond their limit. :)

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8 mins ago, TimS said:

That's not a real 'warranty' program...it's above and beyond. Accidents aren't warranty failure...maybe these companies are the reason so many people today think slamming their rod in the door or high sticking a little bass in the surf til the rod tip folds is a 'warranty' issue? 

 

 

Perhaps warranty is the wrong word.

 

But it's definitely why. And a big reason St Croix sells so may rods.  It's nice knowing if you spend crazy money on a rod, it does not have to be babied and if the car door scenario happens you are not 100% buried.  I have broken a bunch St Croix rods over the years (my nephew broke three of mine at once - ceiling fan)  - never once was there a defect all user error lol. They also have an upgrade program so the "break the rod over your knee" issue is moot

 

My guess is given the scale of their business, their major costs are in tooling and marketing - the cost  of the actual rod is minimal - the rod is basically just a commoditized piece of cheap plastic. If the build a thousand or 10 thousand rods the cost of the actual rod to them is nearly the same.    Must be good business in not having to fight every warranty claim and the customer loyalty it engenders.

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14 mins ago, CrashHard23 said:

 

I am talking about warranty. The program that St Croix offers and Levari is talking about is NOT a warranty program  its a service plan. Gets the facts right! 

 

 

FINALLY ! ! ! . . .  

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10 mins ago, CrashHard23 said:

 

I am talking about warranty. The program that St Croix offers and Levari is talking about is NOT a warranty program  its a service plan. Gets the facts right! 

 

 

You say tomato, I say tomato.  There is essential no difference in the two.  The word warranty is being use to cover a lot of area that its legal definition does not cover.

 

Lets face it, St Croix's manufacturing error rate is virtually zero. Thus making the true warranty on manufacturer's defects worth little. For every 10,000 rods they build, one might have a warranty defect...maybe.  And for every 10,000 rods that are broken, one might be because of a manufacturing defect...maybe. They are building a fishing rod not the space shuttle.

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On ‎7‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 10:21 AM, QHNM said:

A friend of mine is looking for a light in weight quality rod and he didn't like the SC Legend. blackhole surf 10'6 3/4-4oz blank is 7oz but the whole rod weight i can't find anywhere for this info. He casted my Star VPR and he loved it but he hates the single foot guides. he asked me help him to find a rod with similar action and light as the VPR but not the single foot guides. i have a chance to touch the Frontier it's heavier than the VPR but will be acceptable and i believe the blackhole is light too...

does anyone own at least one of these rods, the Frontier and BH nano light? he preferred the 50/50 split but 70/30 is acceptable too.. it looks like BH is his favor on the split thing

Thanks

Too bad this simple question generated a crap storm of stuff pushing the discussion away from what QHNM asked.  :dismay:

Edited by fishless

"I was a waste of time dumbasses"  Sevenxseventy1

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4 mins ago, CrashHard23 said:

 

I am talking about warranty. The program that St Croix offers and Levari is talking about is NOT a warranty program  its a service plan. Gets the facts right! 

 

 

Levari's point was not about the difference between 'warranty' and "service plan'...his original point is that St. Croix has a way to take care of accidental situations unlike other manufacturers. See the forest through the trees!

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. . . yes there is . . . manufacturer defect / workmanship => WARRANTY  (minimum or no cost)  /  accident (or stupidity) => Service Plan ($$ to play) . . .  10k with .01% defect . . . impressive numbers . . . don't  think even St. Croix know they are this good . . . guess they SHOULD start building the space shuttle . . .

 

BTW . . . don't think OP will go wrong with either ODM or BH . . . (just to keep it on topic :wave:)

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1 hour ago, TimS said:

That's not a real 'warranty' program...it's above and beyond. Accidents aren't warranty failure...maybe these companies are the reason so many people today think slamming their rod in the door or high sticking a little bass in the surf til the rod tip folds is a 'warranty' issue? 

 

Equipment abuse, misuse and accidents have never been considered the same kinda problem as a manufacturing/material defect covered under warranty :idea:

 

TimS

It’s not free. Why would anyone slam their used functional rod and pay 

$100 to replace it? Also, the majority are not scam bags so I don’t think your point is valid. Also, with StCroix you can save yourself the breaking part and just order a new top. No conditions are attached to this service. Since most breakage are the top part, if I was a small company I would consider this service with perhaps a little higher cost for top sections.

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20 hours ago, levari said:

It's a lot of money for a fishing rod and I would expect companies to offer the same warranty offered by StCroix with some small margin. StCroix offers no questions asked warranty to cover such incidents. This warranty will cover the full rod. You will have to put down like $100 to replace the rod if it is your fault.

Again, no matter what they are calling this, it is not a warranty. Warranty doesn't cover slamming your rod in the door or the rocks or high sticking. And 'no questions asked warranty' coverage wouldn't cost anything - if it does cost anything it should be called insurance. A warranty, by definition is when a company guarantees to repair or replace a FAULTY product during the warranty period. A rod that is smashed in a door or on the rocks is not faulty.  Again, I think this is why the younger generations think a broken rod automatically means a 'warranty' :scared:  It doesn't. 

 

If the rods was faulty there should never be a charge to replace it...not even $60. Faulty rods don't wait a couple years to suddenly blow up...if they are fished a faulty rod will break within the first year. A one year WARRANTY is all a quality product, even one the manufacturer has the utmost confidence in, will ever need.  A company that has a policy of replacing rods that are NOT faulty but get broken by improper use or accidents should, honestly, not be called a warranty...it should be called a replacement policy or something along those lines. It would certainly help with the apparent confusion many folks have with what warranty actually means :o

 

TimS

Show someone how to catch striped bass and they'll be ready to fish anywhere.
Show someone where to go striped bass fishing and you'll have a desperate report chaser with loose lips.

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3 hours ago, Cpalms said:

Get off this guys back already with this high and mighty BS

 

My only issue is that he's calling it a warranty....and if that's what St. Croix calls it then that's not even his fault. Sticking a rod in a fan is not a warranty, even if they replaced it for free - which they don't. A replacement policy is a much better word for it.

 

3 hours ago, Romer Treece said:

And that's his point in his previous posts...St. Croix's warranty program takes this into account. As pointed out above from their website..."Accidents happen. If your rod has been damaged, St. Croix’s Gold Star Service Plan provides quick repair or replacement without subjecting owners to a lengthy warranty claim process."

There it is, from their site, thank you :th: It is NOT called a warranty, it's called "Gold Star SERVICE PLAN" :read:  That makes more sense...so the folks that have been calling this a 'warranty' are inadvertently spreading false information. It is not a warranty, it's a 'service plan'...so when you say you don't want to buy rods from a company that doesn't offer a 'warranty' for 5 year old rods you fell on...you need to keep looking because St. Croix is also NOT offering a warranty for rods you've fallen on. They are giving you a service plan...that you are paying for. 

 

Nobody will warranty your falling on a 5 year old rod. Some companies apparently will offer a paid service plan to replace rods in case of accident - and some don't. In neither case does it have anything to do with how much a company will stand behind their products. What is the length of time that St. Croix offers a free replacement for a defective rod? 

 

TimS

Show someone how to catch striped bass and they'll be ready to fish anywhere.
Show someone where to go striped bass fishing and you'll have a desperate report chaser with loose lips.

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1 hour ago, levari said:

It’s not free. Why would anyone slam their used functional rod and pay 

$100 to replace it? Also, the majority are not scam bags so I don’t think your point is valid.

Sorry, you completely lost me - where did I suggest anyone would slam their functional rod and pay $100 to replace it? And where did I say anything about 'scam bags'? Generally I can figure out what you are saying...this isn't one of those times :)

 

TimS

Show someone how to catch striped bass and they'll be ready to fish anywhere.
Show someone where to go striped bass fishing and you'll have a desperate report chaser with loose lips.

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I currently have a warranty issue with ODM on a broken Frontier X. The rod has been well cared for with no nicks in the finish and besides the break could pass for as new condition. I called Steve at ODM and was told the rod was under warranty however it must have been an accidental breakage due to the fact that I have had it for a while and it would have broken during its first few uses if it was a manufacturers defect.(He determined all this just from a phone call, never looked at the rod) I explained the rod definately was not high sticked and broke on a fish at the canal that was well down current, he just wouldnt listen.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by gdc23
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