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Mass to end commercial bass fishing?

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Fergal

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What'd they do with reds when their stocks were tanking?  Ban on keeping fish for sometime, and then slot the limit in most places to protect the young and big girls?  Also, essentially make it a non commercial fish in most places?

 

Seems like that plan worked out pretty well for them

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12 mins ago, jmarino1432 said:

No no. Mass is strictly hook and line for bass

I know, that was my point. Unless of course you count the commercial guys who were sitting out of the east end of the canal this year netting all of the floaters left behind by the recs to get their limit an go home...

 

Recs will continue to point the finger at Comms and vice versa. It's just easier because there are numbers behind the Comm fishery, and it's far more challenging to estimate the Rec numbers. Not to mention, we hear about all of the EPO busts on Comm guys poaching, but not much about Rec guys. 

 

The fact is, there are just too many people fishing without any respect for the fishery. Until that changes, the numbers will continue to suffer. True, genuine, commercial guys fishing by the rules are just filling a quota and trying to earn a living. There are bad apples in every industry. 

 

I am a rec guy, primarily catch and release, and feel rec fishing needs to be more regulated. The canal has to be the number 1 slaughter site for rec bass fishing on the east coast. It was disgusting to see what took place there this season. Too many f'ing heroes wanting their picture taken at the local bait shop. People there every day, keeping bass every day, upgrading fish, hiding fish, giving fish away to people walking by, etc...

 

As long as disrespectful people are fishing, there is going to be poaching (commercial and recreational). If people aren't following the regulations, the populations suffer.

 

 

 

F TOMBO

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12 mins ago, HanoverStriper said:

I know, that was my point. Unless of course you count the commercial guys who were sitting out of the east end of the canal this year netting all of the floaters left behind by the recs to get their limit an go home...

 

Recs will continue to point the finger at Comms and vice versa. It's just easier because there are numbers behind the Comm fishery, and it's far more challenging to estimate the Rec numbers. Not to mention, we hear about all of the EPO busts on Comm guys poaching, but not much about Rec guys. 

 

The fact is, there are just too many people fishing without any respect for the fishery. Until that changes, the numbers will continue to suffer. True, genuine, commercial guys fishing by the rules are just filling a quota and trying to earn a living. There are bad apples in every industry. 

 

I am a rec guy, primarily catch and release, and feel rec fishing needs to be more regulated. The canal has to be the number 1 slaughter site for rec bass fishing on the east coast. It was disgusting to see what took place there this season. Too many f'ing heroes wanting their picture taken at the local bait shop. People there every day, keeping bass every day, upgrading fish, hiding fish, giving fish away to people walking by, etc...

 

As long as disrespectful people are fishing, there is going to be poaching (commercial and recreational). If people aren't following the regulations, the populations suffer.

 

 

 

:th: :clap:

 

 

F Tombo

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What was done last time seemed to work pretty well (?).  Something just seems wrong with the “maintenance”.  

 

Maybe too lax too fast and combined with a broadly over eager population of fisherman.

 

I do believe slot limits would help the species but I def do agree once anything is worth $ to anyone, it will be exploited - and its generally the poaching and not the legit crowd that’s doing the most damage.  Taking away or dramatically limiting (ridiculous fines for poaching - seller or buyer - so the risk is just not worth it) any monetary incentive will help too curb abuse - can’t deny that.

 

Are many of you saying you witnessed various forms of poaching and did nothing - didn’t even say anything (?).  If abusers think its a free for all then why would they stop ?  Its not just about “enforcement” its about us - the fisherman - rec + commercial making the effort.  You wanna be catching bass in 10 years - lets figure it out.

 

Personally - I’d suggest whatever they did last time do it again and don’t slag off so fast this time - keep a long term slot limit with ridiculous fines for breaking the rules.

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12 hours ago, nicknotsebastian said:

What was done last time seemed to work pretty well (?).  Something just seems wrong with the “maintenance”.  

 

Maybe too lax too fast and combined with a broadly over eager population of fisherman.

 

I do believe slot limits would help the species but I def do agree once anything is worth $ to anyone, it will be exploited - and its generally the poaching and not the legit crowd that’s doing the most damage.  Taking away or dramatically limiting (ridiculous fines for poaching - seller or buyer - so the risk is just not worth it) any monetary incentive will help too curb abuse - can’t deny that.

 

Are many of you saying you witnessed various forms of poaching and did nothing - didn’t even say anything (?).  If abusers think its a free for all then why would they stop ?  Its not just about “enforcement” its about us - the fisherman - rec + commercial making the effort.  You wanna be catching bass in 10 years - lets figure it out.

 

Personally - I’d suggest whatever they did last time do it again and don’t slag off so fast this time - keep a long term slot limit with ridiculous fines for breaking the rules.

The last stock assessment suggests that you're right.  2 @ 28", coupled with the commerciall quota, was just too much for the stock to tolerate in the long term.  1 @ 28", plus the 25% reduction, looks like it will be enough to maintain the stock, once we give those rules a chance to have an impact on the stock.

 

Unfortunately, folks down in the Chesapeake, as well as the usual suspects in New Jersey, are trying to change the reference points from biological reference points that promote abundance and maintain a relatively large number of older, larger fish in the spawning stock to what we might call "socioeconomic" reference points that will lead to a higher removal rate that will reduce overall abundance and eliminate many of the bigger, older females from the spawning stock, making it more vulnerable to periods of below-average spawning success.

"I have always believed that outdoor writers who come out against fish and wildlife conservation are in the wrong business. To me, it makes as much sense golf writers coming out against grass.."  --  Ted Williams

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16 hours ago, HanoverStriper said:

I know, that was my point. Unless of course you count the commercial guys who were sitting out of the east end of the canal this year netting all of the floaters left behind by the recs to get their limit an go home...

 

Recs will continue to point the finger at Comms and vice versa. It's just easier because there are numbers behind the Comm fishery, and it's far more challenging to estimate the Rec numbers. Not to mention, we hear about all of the EPO busts on Comm guys poaching, but not much about Rec guys. 

 

The fact is, there are just too many people fishing without any respect for the fishery. Until that changes, the numbers will continue to suffer. True, genuine, commercial guys fishing by the rules are just filling a quota and trying to earn a living. There are bad apples in every industry. 

 

I am a rec guy, primarily catch and release, and feel rec fishing needs to be more regulated. The canal has to be the number 1 slaughter site for rec bass fishing on the east coast. It was disgusting to see what took place there this season. Too many f'ing heroes wanting their picture taken at the local bait shop. People there every day, keeping bass every day, upgrading fish, hiding fish, giving fish away to people walking by, etc...

 

As long as disrespectful people are fishing, there is going to be poaching (commercial and recreational). If people aren't following the regulations, the populations suffer.

 

 

 

 

I agree with most of what you say here.  As to the canal being the number 1 slaughter spot - it most certainly was this past season.  As to it being the same next year, odds are it won't be.  There was an unusual set of circumstances that kept the mackerel out in the bay, riding into the canal on a regular basis, followed by the bass.   In a normal year, those bass would have been targeted by the boat comms off of Chatham.

 

The catch along the Canal this past season was unbelievable, and would be unsustainable if it continues year after year, but the odds on that being the norm are pretty slim. 

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2 mins ago, clambellies said:

 

I agree with most of what you say here.  As to the canal being the number 1 slaughter spot - it most certainly was this past season.  As to it being the same next year, odds are it won't be.  There was an unusual set of circumstances that kept the mackerel out in the bay, riding into the canal on a regular basis, followed by the bass.   In a normal year, those bass would have been targeted by the boat comms off of Chatham.

 

The catch along the Canal this past season was unbelievable, and would be unsustainable if it continues year after year, but the odds on that being the norm are pretty slim. 

define sustainable? from roughly 2002-2012 there was a similar, very consistent bite in NJ in the spring. from late may until ~july 4th almost daily blitzes. fish to ~40lbs were easily caught by many on pencils and snag/drop. the most amazing fishing that i have ever seen (and probably won't see again). the number of large fish caught and unfortunately kept was ridiculous. 

 

that bite no longer happens for whatever reason. the bunker are still there but the fish are not. obviously, the fishery is in worse shape now vs then but this past summer at the canal still proves that this fishing can happen. i think bites like these are devastating to the fishery - large numbers of prime breeding congregate to take advantage of forage and get pounded relentlessly. it makes for a goldrush mentality with everyone trying to get theirs with little (and more realistically) regard for the resource. that attitude show that a large number of people that participate in this fishery have no respect for it. 

ASMFC - Destroying public resources and fisheries one stock at a time since 1942.

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All I know is that a lot of Stripes migrate. If they are not off shore, then they our over fished, but that doesn't mean they are over fished here in NE. They can always be taken out at their spawning grounds, like the Chesapeake Bay. I'm not sure how much percentage gets taken out under legal length and over, but I know that federal/state enforcement would be required.

On a separate yet similar note, MA has signs that if you litter (especially on the ccc), you can pay up to 10k for fines, and it is patrolled heavily. Here in NY the fines usually go up to 250/1k and I see nothing but trash floating everywhere. Without heavy enforcement, this talk about regulation laws is futile.

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30 mins ago, clambellies said:

 

I agree with most of what you say here.  As to the canal being the number 1 slaughter spot - it most certainly was this past season.  As to it being the same next year, odds are it won't be.  There was an unusual set of circumstances that kept the mackerel out in the bay, riding into the canal on a regular basis, followed by the bass.   In a normal year, those bass would have been targeted by the boat comms off of Chatham.

 

The catch along the Canal this past season was unbelievable, and would be unsustainable if it continues year after year, but the odds on that being the norm are pretty slim. 

Agree, but I said the #1 slaughter site for Recreational fishermen. 

F TOMBO

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14 hours ago, nicknotsebastian said:

What was done last time seemed to work pretty well (?).  Something just seems wrong with the “maintenance”.  

 

Maybe too lax too fast and combined with a broadly over eager population of fisherman.

 

I do believe slot limits would help the species but I def do agree once anything is worth $ to anyone, it will be exploited - and its generally the poaching and not the legit crowd that’s doing the most damage.  Taking away or dramatically limiting (ridiculous fines for poaching - seller or buyer - so the risk is just not worth it) any monetary incentive will help too curb abuse - can’t deny that.

 

Are many of you saying you witnessed various forms of poaching and did nothing - didn’t even say anything (?).  If abusers think its a free for all then why would they stop ?  Its not just about “enforcement” its about us - the fisherman - rec + commercial making the effort.  You wanna be catching bass in 10 years - lets figure it out.

 

Personally - I’d suggest whatever they did last time do it again and don’t slag off so fast this time - keep a long term slot limit with ridiculous fines for breaking the rules.

One thing we did last time was "PCB's". That probably did more to hold down the poaching and commercial demand than anything we are doing now. 

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22 hours ago, jbaer said:

What'd they do with reds when their stocks were tanking?  Ban on keeping fish for sometime, and then slot the limit in most places to protect the young and big girls?  Also, essentially make it a non commercial fish in most places?

 

Seems like that plan worked out pretty well for them

I wish they would put a slot limit on Striper. It has worked great for redfish down the entire southeastern coast. Plenty of bulls to catch for sport and they get to go back and breed. It is much less taxing on the population to take the small non-breeder size fish, plus the small fish taste better and have accumulated less toxins from the environment.

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On 12/4/2017 at 6:15 AM, pakalolo said:

The age old pissing match between the folks who play with fish for entertainment and those who help feed the nation

Sorry, $25/lb fish doesn't feed the nation - you can buy steak for $6 or $7/lb and that's a completely sustainable and renewable resources raised by their "harvesters" and not a public resource.

 

Recreational fishing feeds the nation - billions of dollars spent annually - that money makes it way through stores, marinas, gas stations, restaurants, hotels, motels, boat builders, tackle manufacturers, and on and on and on and on. That's how you feed a nation, not by offering them $25/lb fish fillets very few people can afford.

 

Just an FYI since you bought up the age old pissing match.

 

TimS

Show someone how to catch striped bass and they'll be ready to fish anywhere.
Show someone where to go striped bass fishing and you'll have a desperate report chaser with loose lips.

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On 12/4/2017 at 7:47 AM, Drew C. said:

i'm not sure what the possible legislation in mass will do with the future unused commercial quota. hopefully, it will be conserved and not turned into additional rec quota.

In the history of state gamefish status how many have not handed over the commercial quota to their recs? I wonder what the record is for how long a state waited before beginning the process to convert the commercial quota to recreational quota? :)

Show someone how to catch striped bass and they'll be ready to fish anywhere.
Show someone where to go striped bass fishing and you'll have a desperate report chaser with loose lips.

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