i have been coating my lures with epoxy,trying to make them more durable to both fish,and the ravages of saltwater.but it seams that after awhile the epoxy has a tendancy to crack,or have a slight spider-web affect.is this due to the expansion of the wood?or should i apply more than one coat of epoxy?any help would be greatly appreciated.
lures and epoxy
Posted July 04 2000 - 2:54 PM
Posted July 04 2000 - 3:22 PM
The epoxy will eventually crack from my experiences.........
Posted July 04 2000 - 5:24 PM
I don't have that problem. Peeling and blushing but not spider cracks. What kind of epoxy are you using, Guzz?
Posted July 05 2000 - 1:11 AM
i get most of it from ace hardware.i believe it's their own brand.maybe it's time for a switch.what do you use?
Posted July 05 2000 - 8:53 AM
Guzz, try a 100% Solids Epoxy. Most of the epoxies sold at the hardware stores fall into 2 catagories
1) High Solids
2) Polyamids - Has an ample VOC contents
Try to find a manufacturer to supply you
with a 100% Solids epoxy in a clear finish.
If you are making your own plugs - then I recommend using a water based 2 part epoxy followed by a 100% solids.
If you coating ready-made lures or plugs, make sure the surface is lightly sanded because the clear urethane polycoat that they put on these lures will not allow the epoxy to stick to the lures well. Remember
proper surface prep is sooo important.
Hope this helps.
P.S (Check out the Thomas Register under epoxy manufacturers)
Posted July 05 2000 - 10:53 AM
thanks pete.i'll have to check out the solids..it's obviously time for a change in brands,and technique.thanks again.
Posted July 05 2000 - 2:58 PM
hey pete,one other question.i use hardened dowels to make all my plugs.do you think that the harder wood could be the reason for the cracking?i once read a post that dowels swell under the pressure of epoxy.have you ever heard of this?
Posted July 05 2000 - 3:17 PM
I've heard that the harder woods will not hold the paint, is the paint peeling or just the epoxy cracking?
I'm not sure of this, but in the old days some of the plug manufacturers used to soak the wook in oil to make the paint adhere when using harder wooods.
Cedar works great.
Dubs a.k.a., Charlie
Posted July 05 2000 - 3:31 PM
the cracks go to the bare wood.both the paint an epoxy seem to crack in unison.for the life of me, i can't figure out why this is happening.i used to put on three coats of clear enamel,but opted for the hardness and durability of epoxy.but i can't seem to figure out this cracking problem.
Posted July 05 2000 - 3:48 PM
It sounds like a compatibility problem between the paint and epoxy. Certain types of chemicals just don't mix, I've seen it in the past when you put the wrong paint on another paint and it turns to alligator skin, this might be your problem.
If the paints sticking to the wood ok, than I would assume its a chemical reaction.
Dubs a.k.a., Charlie
Posted July 05 2000 - 3:49 PM
Has anyone fooled around with **** epoxys? They are designed to be used to repair wooden boats. Should work well around water.
Posted July 05 2000 - 3:56 PM
I had problems with splitting, cracking homemade plugs until I began dipping them in a boiled linseed oil/turpentine solution, then drying them completely. A couple of coats of base, the color coat, then a clear sealer (purchased from a craft shop). The only thing that gets through now are razorlips and the occasional errant cast that zings a jetty rock.
Posted July 05 2000 - 4:09 PM
the cracking doesn't occur right away.it usually starts to rear its ugly head after the lure has had a few good soakings.i don't mix paint bases.it's all enamel.and even the same brand name paint and epoxy.the paint seems to adhear very well to the wood.but here's a quick run down on the sanding and painting deal. maybe i'm screwing something up here.rough cut plug with 60 grit(i use a belt sander to shape the dowels) then take out any nicks or burns with 220.hand sand with 320.two coats of primer.two coats of white.colored paint.two coats of clear enamel(to bring out brightness in colored paint) one coat 30 minute epoxy brushed on thin.that's about it. i've tried two differnt brands of epoxy.ace,and devcon.same results.what am i doing wrong?
Posted July 05 2000 - 4:23 PM
Hardwood or not, it doesn't matter at all if your surface prep is good.
Here is the theory behind not sticking: Hard
wood is less porous than soft wood, thus you will have to roughen the surface up before applying the epoxy coat. Softer the wood,
lesser the roughening required. The best
way to describe this is a mirror and a concrete slab. Mirror is not pourous at all and if paint is applied on it, it basically sits on it without adhering, thus it is entirely dependent on its tensile strength. Now if you apply paint on a concrete slab, it is pourous, thus the paint has a chance to 'grab' on to the surface of it.
Oh yes, make sure your dowels are 100% dry and they really shoudn't be treated with any
chemicals. If they are treated, I would stay
away from it.
As I said before, to achieve high quality
lures, cut your shape out, prime the surface
with a water based epoxy, allow to dry no more than 18 hours(all epoxies have a time frame of adhesion to new coatings, if you pass this time frame, the primer will not adhere well to the epoxy top coat, in other words, you will not get a chemical bond) and then start coating with your favorite colors using epoxy.
Finally, I recommend a 2 part epoxy clear coat or a one part marine urethane (use 2 coats if using marine urethane).
There is one thing - Remember enamels and epoxies dont mix. You cannot apply an epoxy
over an enamel, you will not get any adhesion and will start peeling and cracking like you won't believe. And you also cannot absolutely apply an enamel over epoxy unless
you use a water based epoxy followed by a water based paint. Remember that enamels are
part of the Alkyd family and epoxies are part of amines family. They basically hate each others guts bottom line.
By the way, here something intresting, if you are worried about razor lips blues, there is a solution for this as well. You see epoxies come in different flavors. You guys may want to invest in a ceramic 100% solids epoxy which is extremely abrasion resistant. I know this comes in white and gray and other colors can be manufactured as well. These things are used for condensor
tubes, inside the pipes that carry sludge and hoppers in mines. It is a specialized epoxy and it is expensive, but no way in the world will a blue be able to bite into it.
I hope this helps.
[This message has been edited by Montauk Pete (edited 07-05-2000).]
Posted July 05 2000 - 5:14 PM
I have had the same type of cracking problem and noticed that the epoxy remains adhered to the paint, but the paint and epoxy coat detach from the undercoat or the wood.
I made some patriot-type poppers out of pvc pipe and never have seen any cracking of the finish.
I concluded the basic problem is paper in the wood. This happens either because the wood is not totally dry when the plug is made or water absorbs into the wood thru a damaged area. I have tried to fixes: first I make sure the wood is dry before I start and then I heat the plug in a low oven and then coat the bare wood lightly with epoxy. The warm wood absorbs the epoxy and hopefully seals out moisture unless there is serious damage to the plug. I am still hoping my fixes work--I haven't had any problems yet this season. If this doesn't work I will give up on epoxy finishes--too much work to refinish.